Coup de grace Question

[Ginglebrix]

I know that casting a spell and performing a coup de grace both trigger AoO.

Using your AoO, you hit the spellcaster who must then make a concentration check or have the casting of his/her spell ruined.

Using your AoO, you hit the bad guy getting ready to slit your friends throat. Does this affect the completion of the coup de grace manuever?

I see nothing to support this; however, thinking the only way to stop your buddy from dying is to kill the foe with a single AoO is a little rough.

What is everyone else's understanding of this?

[Xaratherus]

An AoO doesn't interrupt any action that doesn't specifically have rules that state it's interrupted.

So a coup de grace would not be interrupted; in order for the AoO to stop the kill you'd either have to kill him with the AoO (or AoOs; he would provoke from all targets that threaten him currently) or you'd have to attempt a combat maneuver that would otherwise interrupt (like a trip or disarm).

[JHFizban]

Grapple him to prevent him from finishing (or would it?).

Bull Rush him so he's no longer adjacent to your buddy.

Disarm him so he no longer has a weapon suitable to perform the CDG.

Stun, Hold, maybe Charm... I think there are a good number of options available for dealing with this. Unfortunately, I don't think just damaging him is enough to interrupt the CDG maneuver, unless as you noted, it's enough to drop him. :)

EDIT: Oops, just noticed this is supposed to be an AoO as a result of the CDG provoking one... so most of the options I list aren't available to perform as part of your own AoO. Disarm still works though, maybe Stunning Fist could be declared as part of an unarmed AoO if you have the proper feats/abilities. Otherwise, you're going to have to do the other interruption actions I suggested as part of your turn, before the enemy finishes his full-round action.

[Ginglebrix]

You can use special combat maneuvers such as grapple, trip, etc as your AoO?

[drbuzzard]

yes

[redward]

Ginglebrix wrote:

You can use special combat maneuvers such as grapple, trip, etc as your AoO?

Certain maneuvers, such as Trip and Disarm can be used in place of a melee attack, which includes Attacks of Opportunity. Others, such as Grapple and Dirty Trick, specify that they are Standard Actions. You'd need to look at the description of the specific maneuver in question to determine whether it could be used in place of an attack.

[Xaratherus]

Ginglebrix wrote:

You can use special combat maneuvers such as grapple, trip, etc as your AoO?

It depends on the combat maneuver in question. If the maneuver specifically requires a standard action then no; Grapple states it requires a standard action, so you couldn't do that on an AoO.

However, many maneuvers - Disarm for example - state that you can do them in place of a melee attack, and so you can use those during an AoO.

[edit]
I think it may have been discussed before, but this raises a question: A coup de grace, being a full-round action, restricts what else you can do. It explicitly bars you from movement and allows you to take free or swift actions. An AoO is not defined as any particular action type - so could someone performing a coup de grace make an AoO against someone who attempts to disarm him (assuming the person performing the maneuver didn't have Improved Disarm)?

I'd tend to say 'no', but not certain based on the RAW.

[JHFizban]

Well, not Grapple... but Trip, Disarm, maybe Sunder (I'm not sure on that one).

Now that I rethink it though, I believe I was mistaken above, as a CDG is only a full-round action, not a 1-round action... meaning, it completes on the attacker's turn, rather than him standing there and everyone getting a turn to try to do something about it before it finishes.

So with that in mind, the best thing I can think of to stop a CDG using your AoO would be to attempt to Disarm, unless you have some special ability (Stunning Fist or something similar).

[ZZTRaider]

JHFizban wrote:

Otherwise, you're going to have to do the other interruption actions I suggested as part of your turn, before the enemy finishes his full-round action.

The Coup de Grace completes at the end of the attacker's turn -- you don't have a round to deal with it. It's a full round action, just like a full attack.

This is distinctly different from spells with a one round cast time (such as Summon Monster), where you are considered to be casting until just before your next turn. Of course, to add to the confusion, it is a full round action to start casting a spell with a one round cast time...

Basically, the best defense against Coup de Grace is to never get in a position where it can be used. It's not perfect (Hold Person is deadly), but it's difficult to counter once it starts.

EDIT: Ninja'd.

[Ginglebrix]

Thank you, everyone. This provides a few outlets for heroic and selfless acts =)