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I'm looking for a somewhat-official response before I spend my gold; as far as I can tell, Darkleaf Cloth is a valid special material for use when constructing a whip (and is, in fact, the only such legal special material). So I plan to buy a masterwork one once I get the coin so I can get it properly enchanted some day.
However, there are a few uncertain points. As a given, the whip weighs 2 pounds, costs 1 gp, and, generally-speaking, a masterwork quality for a weapon costs 300 gp.
The uncertainty enters when trying to figure out what that means for darkleaf cloth, the non-armor cost being +375/lb. Darkleaf cloth halves the weight of objects made with it, and it specifically says that *armor* made with it has the masterwork cost factored in, but is somewhat more ambiguous/silent about weapons. So, as far as I can tell, any of the following might be an accurate calculation:
Masterwork cost factored in, weight halved before calculating cost:
1 (whip)
+375 (darkleaf cloth)
------
376 gp
Masterwork cost *not* factored in, weight halved before calculating cost:
1 (whip)
+375 (darkleaf cloth)
+300 (masterwork)
------
676 gp
Masterwork cost factored in, weight *not* halved before calculating cost:
1 (whip)
+750 (darkleaf cloth)
------
751 gp
Masterwork cost *not* factored in, weight *not* halved before calculating cost:
1 (whip)
+750 (darkleaf cloth)
+300 (masterwork)
------
1051 gp
What I'm looking for is:
- confirmation that a Darkleaf Cloth Whip is, indeed, a legal option
- assuming it is legal, an idea of which method I should use when calculating its cost
Any help would be much appreciated!
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Based on various Mithril items that are statted independently, you calculate cost before dividing.
Huh; yeah, that could work! Do you know where I could find the independently-priced mithral items for comparison?
Unfortunately, the fact that Mithral specifically calls out weapons as masterwork and Darkleaf Cloth doesn't leads me to believe that, by RAW, I'd have to add masterwork separately (although by RAI, I suspect it's an oversight). So I'm probably looking at 1051 gp, then.
(as a side question, does anyone know who I should look to contact for official rulings about PFS Organized Play rules, once I figure out what it should cost to make sure it's legal?)
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Except that the wood weapons explicitly call out that master work has to be paid for separately. So we have explicit examples both ways. I think it comes down to "no one thought of making weapons out of cloth."
Ultimate Equipment, Page 56 item table (and associated descriptions) includes Mithral:
Cauldron
Grappling Hook
Manacles
Pot
Skillet
Waffle Iron(?really?)
Note that in spite of mithral only saying that armor and weapons get the masterwork quality:
Mithral Manacles: These bindings are more difficult to
break than standard manacles and are particularly useful
against lycanthropes. They have hardness 15, 30 hit
points, and a break DC of 30. They are otherwise treated as
masterwork manacles
(From the descriptions, we also learn that Mithral is nonstick, making it excellent for cookware, and also magnetic.)
Oh, and having gone back to look over that list, it looks like I was wrong. They are using the finished weight of the mithral item, not the weight of the non mithral version to calculate cost. Interestingly, Mithral manacles, instead of being lighter, get 3x the hitpoints. I guess no one felt there was much point making light manacles.
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Except that the wood weapons explicitly call out that master work has to be paid for separately. So we have explicit examples both ways. I think it comes down to "no one thought of making weapons out of cloth."
Yeah, that was what I figured, too. I probably wouldn't have thought of it, myself, if I hadn't made the decision to make a whip my character's signature weapon.
Oh, and having gone back to look over that list, it looks like I was wrong. They are using the finished weight of the mithral item, not the weight of the non mithral version to calculate cost. Interestingly, Mithral manacles, instead of being lighter, get 3x the hitpoints. I guess no one felt there was much point making light manacles.
Alright; so we're probably looking at either 376 or 676 gp, depending whether or not the masterwork quality is inherent. Although that point is rather vague, since other entries explicitly call out weapons, one way or another. So I guess that's the next thing to figure out about the price. :\a
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Based on the precedents set forth by the other special materials, I'd have to say that whenever an item possess inherent masterwork quality for its cost, that fact is pointed out (even though you still have to pay masterwork cost+ for greenwood). For example, Cold Iron, Alchemical Silver, and Elysian Bronze all omit mentions of inherent masterwork qualities in weapons, while Adamantine and Frost-/Fire-Forged make specific mention that weapons made of them possess it.
Thus, by RAW, I suspect I'd have to assume it's not included. Still, by RAI, I suspect it's an oversight since armor made of it *does* automatically get masterwork quality.
Thus, for now, I'm thinking 676 gp.
Any other opinions out there? Can anyone confirm whether it's legal for PFS?
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I'm in the same fix, as a gnome bard with a scorpion whip.
(on the other hand I am still giggling over the mithral waffle iron.)
I think I've seen a number of people mention using metallic special materials with scorpion whips (to represent the blades woven in). Of course, when it comes to the material for the whip itself, it appears our special materials options are a bit more limited.
(Those would be some pretty expensive waffles; almost like a status symbol in and of themselves. Plus, who wouldn't want cookware made of mithral? Fry omelettes and, in a pinch, use them to bash in a werewolf's skull! In fact, my character gets catch off-guard next level, and I have no silver weapons yet... >.>)
I hope the rest of the party likes waffles!
