Bard build advice


Advice


I'm helping create a character for a player who isn't that interested in the combat side of things. We've brainstormed up an old human bard (Savage Skald) who fits the campaign wonderfully, and is the grandmother to one of the other PCs. I think this will be very rewarding.

I'm looking for more ideas for what this character could do in combat. Scouring the guides, I have plenty already. Of course, there are spells and bardic performance, and she'll have an outstanding charisma. She'll likely use a net and thrown alchemical items, which don't require too much dexterity to use well. Intimidate checks, perhaps through Dazzling Display, could also be good.

All that should take up plenty of combat time. I just want to know if there are any fun things I haven't thought of yet. Any additions I can make to her bag of tricks?

The party is a human viking (grandson), a human zen archer, a half-elf cleric of Nethys, and a (probably) human sorcerer.


Aid another.
Study the monsters and do Knowledge checks.
Get into flanking position.


Knowledge checks will naturally be a big part of her repertoire - she's styled as a storyteller. She's probably no good in melee, so I don't think she's much of a flanker, but Aid Another is a good suggestion. Thanks!


Aid another requires being in combat.

In no particular order:
Performances, buff spells, blistering invective, sound strike, Demoralize (intimidate skill), debuff spells, knowledge checks.

In general, bards shine best in combat by making their party more deadly rather than joining the fray.


aid another with a whip is great


DeltaOneG wrote:
Aid another requires being in combat.

False, aid another does NOT require being in combat. I've copied the RAW for you below.

Aid Another:

You can help someone achieve success on a skill check by making the same kind of skill check in a cooperative effort. If you roll a 10 or higher on your check, the character you're helping gets a +2 bonus on his or her check. (You can't take 10 on a skill check to aid another.) In many cases, a character's help won't be beneficial, or only a limited number of characters can help at once.

In cases where the skill restricts who can achieve certain results, such as trying to open a lock using Disable Device, you can't aid another to grant a bonus to a task that your character couldn't achieve alone. The GM might impose further restrictions to aiding another on a case-by-case basis as well.

DeltaOneG wrote:
In general, bards shine best in combat by making their party more deadly rather than joining the fray.

Also false, bards have some of the best abilities out of combat in the game. Just look at how many skills points they get (6 + Int Modifier). They can even take 10's on knowledge rolls by level 5.

Lore Master (Ex):
At 5th level, the bard becomes a master of lore and can take 10 on any Knowledge skill check that he has ranks in. A bard can choose not to take 10 and can instead roll normally. In addition, once per day, the bard can take 20 on any Knowledge skill check as a standard action. He can use this ability one additional time per day for every six levels he possesses beyond 5th, to a maximum of three times per day at 17th level.

In summation, bards are great for boosting their party members in combat, great at skill checks and knowledge checks out of combat, and great at being the face of the party. Bards are probably one of the best classes in the game for someone who doesn't like to be in combat, but prefers the RP aspect of the game and helping their party wherever and whenever possible.


Bards can easily be great in either melee or ranged combat if built with that in mind, as their buffs apply to themselves as well. They don't even have to give up much of their out-of-combat utility for that, thanks to things like 6 skill points/level, Lore Master, Versatile Performance, and Bardic Knowledge. Melee or ranged expertise aren't much of an option for an old-age character, sadly. Moreso for one starting at first level. :/

I've played with more than a few bards, so I'm familiar with some of the various ways to build bards and what they can offer a party. I'm just curious if there's anything else I'm missing for this one. Blistering Invective is a particularly appropriate suggestion - I think we can skip Dazzling Display.

Thanks, guys! Keep the suggestions coming!


ub3r_n3rd wrote:
DeltaOneG wrote:
Aid another requires being in combat.

False, aid another does NOT require being in combat. I've copied the RAW for you below.

** spoiler omitted **

Sorry, meant to say "in melee" with specific reference to using aid another while in combat.

ub3r_n3rd wrote:
DeltaOneG wrote:
In general, bards shine best in combat by making their party more deadly rather than joining the fray.

Also false, bards have some of the best abilities out of combat in the game. Just look at how many skills points they get (6 + Int Modifier). They can even take 10's on knowledge rolls by level 5.

** spoiler omitted **

Better wording would probably been "in combat bards shine best by making..." but my comments were directed at the OPs question "what will they do in combat".

As to the OP: I'm interested what you mean by "isn't that interested in the combat side of things". Does that mean they don't really want to participate in combat or they just don't want to deal with all the mechanics. If the latter then I'd say things like performance or buff spells where they don't have to roll or anything are best. If the former then I have no advice except to bring a quick wit and some jokes to make the night more pleasant for everyone there. Also, if they don't want to get into the nit and gritty of combat remember that worse than not helping in combat is taking a long time to not help or making combat more difficult for everyone else (i.e. cloud kill around the BBEG immune to poison).

ub3r_n3rd wrote:
In summation, bards are great for boosting their party members in combat, great at skill checks and knowledge checks out of combat, and great at being the face of the party.
Agreed.
ub3r_n3rd wrote:
Bards are probably one of the best classes in the game for someone who doesn't like to be in combat, but prefers the RP...

I don't believe class will affect the outcome of this preference.


She thinks combat is fairly boring, and she isn't much into character mechanics. So, both, I guess. This makes Pathfinder not the best system for her, but, well, this game is Pathfinder, and she's interested in the campaign. (We play a lot of other games too.)

She's getting to like her character concept, now that she has one. Also, she loves rolling dice, so she'll want some attack potential. (Hence, net and intimidate.) She's very interested in unusual tactics, so that's what I'm here looking for. I think they will help keep her interest. Her turns shouldn't take a long time.

Eldritch Heritage is another possibility. The Accursed, Deep Earth, or Verdant bloodlines specifically might be worthwhile for the combat maneuvers or intimidation.


Not sure how determined you/she is to take Savage Skald. Sound Striker might be easier even though it doesn't have as specific a viking tie-in. I've always thought word strike and weird words would be awesome played as given the enemy a talk'n so sever it hurts.


She's loving the idea to incite rage in her allies or to summon a team of barbarians to do her bidding. Savage Skald is good, but we're open to suggestions. I've never seen anything with Sound Striker to count it as a good option, though. Your flavor idea is a good one.


Sound striker is awesome! Just flavor her as a witch doctor or shamanistic lore keeper for the tribe. Flavor can be added to dern near any concept if you are willing to try it.


The PC might also look into various wands for helping to heal/buff/etc.

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