So I wanted to play a character with a dragon, but how can you reasonably justify getting one? They're completely above the curve for similarly sized companions, and if you want a dragon to be of helpful size in a reasonable amount of time, you have to cram size increases in a 20 level progression.
So I set out to make a reasonable proposal to my GM and here's what I came up with: An Aasimar Oracle of Nature with the bonded mount revelation, taking a homebrew feat called Dragon Companion.
So first of all, as an Aasimar, you get an awesome favored class bonus that adds half your level to a revelation of choice, so that allowed me to spread out the dragon's progression over 30 levels, instead of 20.
The Dragon Companion feat is as advertised; it gives you the option to take a Dragon in place of your normal animal companion. For the purposes of this character, a Gold Dragon. How is this balanced? Well, our GM allows leadership. A clause of this feat is that if you take it, you can't take leadership. It's a sort of "one amazing feat per character" rule. So given that this replaces your cohort and so on, it begins to look more reasonable.
So here's the link to the Google Doc: (There are 3 tabs)
Think I left something unfinished? Think it's completely unbalanced? Let me know what you think!
That's an interesting class, and certainly something I'll mention to one of my dragon-obsessed friends as something to use in the future.
...but it doesn't exactly serve the purposes I intended. Still hoping my Dragon Companion feat will work out in some way.
EDIT: Although the dragonrider dragon as a reference point may prove useful; I may be able finagle raising the starting Strength of my dragon; 9 is a little low.
So I wanted to play a character with a dragon, but how can you reasonably justify getting one? They're completely above the curve for similarly sized companions, and if you want a dragon to be of helpful size in a reasonable amount of time, you have to cram size increases in a 20 level progression.
There are rules for dragon cohorts via the leadership feat. A young bronze dragon is large enough to be a human's mount and counts as a level 17 cohort (if my math is correct). But, yes, this doesn't leave you with much room for development since it's only available at level 19.
This is, of course, by design. A dragon companion would be overpowering at lower levels.
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So I wanted to play a character with a dragon, but how can you reasonably justify getting one? ...
There's some rules options for that in Book of Drakes.
Your feat & the dragon writeup just seems to bypass the standard mechanics by which to acquire a dragon cohort (minimum age young, CR + 8 required leadership score - the lowest of which I found was 20) and ignore the standard rules by which they level (as fighters or sorcerers).
I think your feat is pure cheddar. It is not just powerful, it is significantly more powerful than any other animal companion available.
"Well, our GM allows leadership" isn't a justification. Leadership is a cool summer breeze of perfect balance compared to this.
Your feat & the dragon writeup just seems to bypass the standard mechanics by which to acquire a dragon cohort (minimum age young, CR + 8 required leadership score - the lowest of which I found was 20) and ignore the standard rules by which they level (as fighters or sorcerers).
I think your feat is pure cheddar. It is not just powerful, it is significantly more powerful than any other animal companion available.
"Well, our GM allows leadership" isn't a justification. Leadership is a cool summer breeze of perfect balance compared to this.
Well, you're probably right? But what aspect of it do you think is overpowering? (Stats? Casting? Abilities? Something else?) Is there some way to bring it more in line with what you'd expect to replace Leadership and a mount of 1.5 x Class Level?
EDIT: It is intentional that it pushes the limits of versatility and power of what could be normally accomplished with an animal companion, but at the same time, I'm hoping to introduce something balanced enough that it doesn't completely warp our group's campaign.
I'm really not trying to be an ass, so I'll just give you the short list of how I'd do it, assuming my player was going for the "look" and not the super-charged stats. I've had several ideas wrapped in the guise of "for RP purposes" presented to me by one of my more munchkin-like players get dropped when presented with my attempts to grant their wishes - for the sake of RP.
As a GM, I would do the following:
Create a "Gold Dragon[ling]"
Assign stats similar to other animal companions of the level.
At 7th, grant flight & size increase.
In all other respects, it would level as an animal companion.
Trouble is, it's not a single, easily-omitted thing. Strong stats across the board (aside from Dex); the numerous immunities, senses and good saves allowed to the Dragon type; total immunity to an element, for most dragon types; flight; plus all the other little bits that come in later, such as SR, dragonfear and spellcasting... They have everything, so it's hard to point at one single point and say "This, and this alone, makes the dragon too powerful to be a cohort."
But my dragon companion doesn't have most of those things.
It doesn't have SR, dragonfear... It does gain spellcasting, and by the time that's relevant, it would still be behind the casting you'd expect from a cohort? And the dragon still has only one standard action per turn. I suppose I could tone that down if I had to.
Flight is a legitimate concern, but it also can't ferry players around until... Level 12? (18 on the table) That's when he's large sized.
EDIT: Also, it has Mid BAB, poor will saves and a d8 hit die. I was trying to model it partially after animal companions.
It's comical to even say this but, just playing a summoner with a serpentine eidolon would be more balanced. The third party class suggested or treating it as a fluffed dino AC are good options as well I think, if you aren't just trying to be über.
As a gm, the only way I would consider using what you propose is if it was a solo game.
As a gm, the only way I would consider using what you propose is if it was a solo game.
Agreed and at that point, why even bother with new mechanics.
Well, my motives aren't as pure as the wind-driven snow, but I do genuinely want to create a dragon that's strong, yet doesn't suck the fun out of it for other players.
And if it helps, if this character concept gets the stamp of approval from my GM, I intend to hand it over to my friend who will roleplay the dragon and treat the Oracle as the cohort. She loves dragons and has the whole pride of a dragon thing down pat.
EDIT: It's sort of a surprise for her; every time someone in our group hints to starting a new campaign, she begs us to allow her to play a dragon character, so I think she'd really like this.
...and she's not a munchkin by any stretch of the imagination.
Well, my motives aren't as pure as the wind-driven snow
I had that feeling.
but I do genuinely want to create a dragon that's strong, yet doesn't suck the fun out of it for other players.
Very difficult.
And if it helps, if this character concept gets the stamp of approval from my GM, I intend to hand it over to my friend who will roleplay the dragon and treat the Oracle as the cohort. She loves dragons and has the whole pride of a dragon thing down pat.
EDIT: It's sort of a surprise for her; every time someone in our group hints to starting a new campaign, she begs us to allow her to play a dragon character, so I think she'd really like this.
...and she's not a munchkin by any stretch of the imagination.
Not unreasonable, but in this case, why not drop the pretense that it is anything but her character?
No oracle cohort, no dragon cohort for you, it's just plain and simply her character and you two can work out how your characters interact?
At worst, it requires the construction of a Dragon Class.
I suppose why I'm so adamant on wanting to make this Dragon Companion feat is hard to relate to without knowing how I got here? Here goes...
Second, I thought "Ooh, maybe I should try this with an Oracle of Nature! Mount with extra levels? Sweet! But is the best I can get a horse or a wolf?"
Third, I thought "Hrmm. I wonder if I could convince my GM to let me get another kind of companion... What would be cool? Something that flies would be nice. A dragon? That'd fun."
Forth, I thought "I'm really starting to dig the idea of a dragon companion, but it seems kind of sad that this very intelligent and potential goldmine of a character is stuck as my cohort, when I can't roleplay worth a damn. Maybe I'll have my friend roleplay it for me... Or maybe, I'll just have her be the dragon? Huh. That could work."
...and that's pretty much everything that's lead up to me posting in these forums. I want to make an Oracle with an amazing companion. I might even make it an Aasimar child with the young template. Basically I want an Oracle who can buff, heal and support while the dragon is the star of the team.
And yeah, maybe I should just give up on my aspirations of making this concept work, but that seems to defeat the purpose of everything that's built up to this point. I want this concept to grace one of our group's campaigns someday; even if I don't control it, I want to see it in action. All the more for someone who loves dragons like she does.
Minor change to the build; instead of getting +2 to Int/Wis/Cha at level 3 and every 6 levels thereafter, it is now simply attached to the same Str/Dex progression of Animal Companions. A smoother and slightly weaker progression.