Better understanding CR


Advice

Grand Lodge

So I was messing around with different creatures and NPCs and decided to take a jab at creating my own. Along the way though I got a little confused on how special abilities/extraordinary powers affect CR. For this demonstration lets use one of Paizo's NPCs as an example; the Expert Bodyguard (see below for Paizo's official stats)

Now let's say that I wanted to make an enemy in my story similar to this, but this enemy had a special background story that involved him being resistant to arcane forces (due to birth, powers, learning, whatever) and grants him Spell Resistance as well. Under Paizo's PRD they claim that a creatures Spell Resistance is usually CR + 11, so in this case he/she now has SR16.

Is this still a CR5? According to the table here the stats match a CR5 pretty well, but the tables don't say anything about Special Abilities or Extraordinary powers and how they affect CR. Does the addition of SR16 now bump him up to CR6 or greater? The PRD states SR doesn't usually show up until CR10 or later. So is this too powerful an ability for this CR? Could I edit some other stats to make the NPC weaker in other areas such as HP, AC, or Attack bonuses to compensate?

In a sense this topic is more about better understanding how Supernatural/Extraordinary abilities affect CR ranking when creating a monster/NPC since they don't really give you a list of all of them and when you should expect to see them. Perhaps I could get some examples from others who have created their own monster/NPCs before.

Thanks for your time and apologies if this topic is silly. Just interested in creating some characters for our new world we will be running soon.

Expert Bodyguard:
Expert Bodyguard CR 5

XP 1,600

Human warrior 7

N Medium humanoid (human)

Init +3; Senses Perception +8

Defense

AC 17, touch 9, flat-footed 17 (+7 armor, –1 Dex, +1 shield)

hp 59 (7d10+21)

Fort +7, Ref +1, Will +5

Offense

Speed 20 ft.

Melee +1 longsword +10/+5 (1d8+2/19–20) or kukri +8/+3 (1d4+1/18–20)

Ranged mwk light crossbow +7 (1d8/19–20)

Tactics

During Combat If she sees an enemy approaching, the warrior fires her screaming bolt before entering melee. In melee, she uses Stand Still to prevent enemies from getting past her, giving her employer time to escape.

Statistics

Str 13, Dex 9, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 8

Base Atk +7; CMB +8; CMD 17

Feats Combat Reflexes, Improved Initiative, Iron Will, Stand Still, Weapon Focus (longsword)

Skills Intimidate +9, Perception +8, Sense Motive +8

Languages Common

Combat Gear potion of barkskin, potion of bear's endurance, potion of cure moderate wounds, screaming bolt, tanglefoot bag (2); Other Gear masterwork banded mail, masterwork light steel shield, +1 longsword, kukri, masterwork light crossbow with 20 bolts, masterwork manacles, 114 gp


Well, the easiest way to look at this would be to add an item that gives you SR16. Find out how much that costs, and see where you end up with the NPC's wealth. I believe creating an NPC with PC level wealth increases the CR by 1.

Based on magic item creation rules an item that granted SR 16 would cost 40,000 gp. Much too expensive for a 5th level NPC.

You're best bet is to simply make the creature one of the base races that can get SR, such as Drow or Dwarves (through the Magic Resistance alternative racial trait). However, please not that these abilities are 6+character level and 5+character level respectively. Drow Nobles have 11+character level SR.

I guess my point is don't assume 11+character level is standard, thats more a general rule for non-humanoid creatures to give you an idea of where they should be.

Grand Lodge

No that makes sense. Was just confusing trying to figure out where special abilities fall in terms of CR. I see that having SR16 (the equivalent of 40000gp) is way too high for a 5th level character now that I am looking at it from a PC standpoint.

Dark Archive

When dealing with unknown or unrated factors you would have to look at the effect it would have in CR appropriate challenge.

Checking the Bestiary, it looks like the stats are in-line, again though - the stats were in-line before your added the SR ability. There are a few creatures in the Bestiary (Bearded Devil & Green Hag) which are both CR 5 and have SR 16.

SR is a significant ability but you would be well within your rights to keep this as a CR 5. I would consider bumping the treasure up to reflect this though, if the xp is going to be only for a fiver. That or throw on a template (like Fiendish) that includes the SR boost and some other small abilities, but for a true CR bump (CR 6).

I don't think it's a big deal if the encounter/conditions are a one-off and this stayed at CR 5 as written. If every other npc has a special background that gave them combat abilities then I would consider it bending the rules a bit too much just to fit your CR budget (take it from me, I'm as cheap as they come).

I have a question for you though - why would you have such a generic character (with npc class levels) have this ability? Why not make her a fighter a level lower and then give the ability?

My concern being is: this is a little bit of a red-lined creature.
HD and BAB are already higher than CR equivalent martial, as are the hp (due to higher HD). Granted not as many feats/abilities, but in raw to-hit, hp and saves compared to a CR appropriate fighter vs. your players. Throwing in an addition to SR it seems like this is a min-maxed creature built for raw numbers - the free SR just seems like you are covering weaknesses to magic without paying out the players for it.

This issue (about ranking and scoring powers) is yet another reason why there should be an Ultimate Monster book.

Grand Lodge

Well once again this wasn't my creature I made, was just using this as an example. The first post was just a test to try to gauge the strength/challenge/difficulty factors that certain special abilities bring when determining what the final CR should be for a monster/NPC.

No min/max or red-lining intentions here as when I finally start making some NPCs they will be balanced enough for their weaknesses to be fully available to exploit. Creating enemies that cover all bases would be suicide for my friends as they are all new to the game. Some people may like challenges but to start I was just getting some ideas.

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