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Hi all!
I do have a specific scenario in mind but I'll post it after I post the rules I see as important. I'm running strict RAW because I'm running a modified setting (Primitives, no metal, just bone/stone/wood/obsidian).
Animals have Int of 1 or 2. Having higher Int uses the Intelligent Animals rules.
Animals have kill points equal to 2 + Int modifier (minimum 1) per Hit Die. The following are class skills for animals: Acrobatics, Climb, Fly, Perception, Stealth, and Swim.
No animal can have ranks in (or make checks in?) a non class skill.
Heal is not a Class skill for an Animal.
Bleeding Attack (Ex)
Bleeding creatures take that amount of damage every round at the start of each of their turns. The bleeding can be stopped by a DC 15 Heal check or the application of any effect that heals hit point damage.
Scenario:
If a 2nd lvl Rogue takes Bleeding Attack (Ex) and does 1 bleed to ....say a Giant Snapping Turtle (stats used for a tortoise as suggested in the entry) with max HP = 154. and does...2 damage with a thrown dagger and 1 bleed (tortoise at 151) and simple keeps ahead of it on a mount while taunting it and staying out of reach (mount is faster than the tortoise's 20ft/rnd)...in 152 rounds the tortise will bleed into Dying, since it is unable to make the Heal check, then and only then getting a chance to stabilize (totally doable). at which point the Rogue can Coup De Grace it or simply keep stabbing it untill it dies....lvl 2 rogue kills a CR9 critter...
Am I running this right?
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IF you can touch its flat footed AC 23,
IF you can sneak attack it (turtle has Perception +21),
IF you don't get killed by its attack (it can charge, AoO, ...),
IF it does not go deep swimming and follows you,
BUT Heal can still be used untrained: (licking its wounds)
it's a DC 15 check (and the turtle has +1).
As soon as the fight ends (rogue retreats from battle, turtle dives down) the turtle can use 'take20' for heal.
Damm! I could have sworn int 1-2 animals were unable to make the needed heal checks.....crap...I played that all wrong.
even as a 3lv 3 party, it took all 4 of them to keep casting grease to make it flat-footed. the Summoner spamming Acid Splash from the back of her special friend (i can never spell it)hitting it's Touch AC of 4 then getting her friend to full move (40ft) so she's just in range.
Grease really messed with it good.
Note: I was using it as a Tortoise (as suggested in the description) so no swimming.
When it tried to run, they harried it enough to make it retract into it's shell for defense....then they just spammed touch acid at it.
All other aside, wouldn't it still be allowed to attempt a stabilize check if at -1 hp (in case the party leaves it alone at that stage)?
Ruyan.
I did make the stabilization test (it passed) the party saw it had stopped bleeding and started spamming Acid Splash to finish it off.
"Stab and wait" is a time-honored hunter tradition. Real-world animals use it too.
A giant snapping turtle can move 20ft and has a reach of 20ft with lunge. With charge it can attack a creature in 60ft distance.
It is gargantuan size with a space of 20ft. Grease only covers 10ft, only a quarter of the turtle. The spells says 'Any creature in the area' so the turtle is only partly in the area and the spell dont work. To be honest .. it is a first level spell, we are talking about a gargantuan creature with a CMD35 against trip and is has four legs (3 standing on a non greased ground).
Grease is a lvl1 spell. A party of 3 full casters have 18 casts available, more with a wand.
Acid Splash does 1d3 damage, 1,5 as average. It needs 76 rounds for one and 25 round for three AS casters to kill the creature.
The turtle a bite +16 with 4d6+16 damage. A hit kills a 3lvl caster.
What about the fighting terrain? Was is a flat surface without trees, hindered terrain etc. that slows down the PCs but not a gargantuan turtle?
Sorry you make a lot of mistakes if you could not kill at least one of the PCs.