So I'm thinking about what I could create if I do Next RPG Superstar, and a thought that occurred to me (although I've already decided against it) is a staff that transforms into a snake. Now, I quickly found out that that has already been done (so I won't be doing it), but it did raise a question for me: does a staff or stave count as a wondrous item. They are listed in two separate sections in Ultimate Equipment, and I'm fairly new to the game, so I really don't know.
Thanks in advance for your answers!
Staff is always a staff. Wondrous item is a catch all for items that don't fit into other categories.
OK, thanks for your time! *somewhat disappointed*
There's nothing wrong with enchanting a wondrous item that looks like a staff. However, you couldn't enchant it to function as a staff.
By "wrong" I mean bad, broken, unbalanced, etc. RAW though, it looks like that's not possible due to how Wondrous Items seem to be defined. On the other hand, there are robes and the like in Wondrous Items when it seems like body slot items should be armor.
You can't use Craft Wondrous Item to create "an item which has ten charges and can use them to cast specific spells". You could use Craft Wondrous Item to make a magical stick which did something else.
"Staff" is a term-of-art for a particular set of rule mechanics, not really that closely tied to the presentation as a magical stick.
nikou wrote: So I'm thinking about what I could create if I do Next RPG Superstar, and a thought that occurred to me (although I've already decided against it) is a staff that transforms into a snake. Now, I quickly found out that that has already been done (so I won't be doing it), but it did raise a question for me: does a staff or stave count as a wondrous item. They are listed in two separate sections in Ultimate Equipment, and I'm fairly new to the game, so I really don't know. UE follows the categories pretty closely (I don't know of any discrepancies), and each category is defined by a unique and necessary feat for its creation. So if it's listed in the Wondrous Items section, it's not a Potion and vice versa. The developers have expressed strong disapproval against crossing item categories because that devalues the feats -- if I can use Create Wondrous Item to make rings, why bother taking Forge Ring? (This is a noted change from earlier editions, where the idea of a hat of invisibility instead of a ring was singled out as a fine idea. There's also literary precedent in the Tarnhelm.)
But if this is a home game, you can do anything you can con your game master into. And if you're the game master, the world is your mollusk of choice.
What would be the most fun for you?
Orfamay Quest wrote: UE follows the categories pretty closely (I don't know of any discrepancies), and each category is defined by a unique and necessary feat for its creation. So if it's listed in the Wondrous Items section, it's not a Potion and vice versa. The developers have expressed strong disapproval against crossing item categories because that devalues the feats -- if I can use Create Wondrous Item to make rings, why bother taking Forge Ring? (This is a noted change from earlier editions, where the idea of a hat of invisibility instead of a ring was singled out as a fine idea. There's also literary precedent in the Tarnhelm.)
But if this is a home game, you can do anything you can con your game master into. And if you're the game master, the world is your mollusk of choice.
What would be the most fun for you?
Yeah, I'm real glad they kept that uniqueness tight. No oils, potions or the like in the Wondrous item section, no sir.
Really, there's no problem with changing the appearance of something without the mechanics. Or are you saying it is impossible to make a wondrous stick that works like any other wondrous item? Seems quite silly. Though I have heard the devs are silly about reflavoring things.
Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
No, it's not impossible.
Ultimate Equipment wrote: Agile alpenstock
Price 2,000 gp; Aura faint transmutation; CL 3rd; Weight 1 lb.
This gnarled wooden walking stick aids a creature's travel, granting a +5 foot enhancement bonus to speed and a +2 enhancement bonus to CMD against trip attempts and on saving throws to avoid being tripped. These bonuses apply as long as the agile alpenstock is held in hand. It can be wielded in combat as a quarterstaff.
CONSTRUCTION REQUIREMENTS
Cost 1,000 gp
Craft Wondrous Item, longstrider
However, you need to be careful about it. Many of the wondrous items similar to potions are wondrous items instead because they can't be made as potions (i.e., personal range, above 3rd-level spell, etc.). Likewise, some wondrous items may look similar to armor pieces, weapons, etc., but actually have different abilities than can be achieved by a "normal" item of that type, as well as not having any abilities of a "normal" item; for example, the agile alpenstock "can be wielded... as a quarterstaff," but gains no enhancement bonus or other benefit as a magic weapon.
Dragonchess Player wrote: However, you need to be careful about it. Many of the wondrous items similar to potions are wondrous items instead because they can't be made as potions (i.e., personal range, above 3rd-level spell, etc.). Likewise, some wondrous items may look similar to armor pieces, weapons, etc., but actually have different abilities than can be achieved by a "normal" item of that type, as well as not having any abilities of a "normal" item; for example, the agile alpenstock "can be wielded... as a quarterstaff," but gains no enhancement bonus or other benefit as a magic weapon. On the potions thing, that really just boils down to potions being a crappy means of crafting. They didn't bother to fix it, so Wondrous Items gets all of the really good stuff.
I'd note that when you have cross-spectrum items like a Staff, usually each type of boost will require the appropriate crafting feat. Though there are Staves with wondrous properties that seem to ignore this. AFAIK, all items that give an enhancement bonus to armor or weapons require Craft Magic Arms and Armor. (Not saying this for you, Dragonchess, but for others).
Drachasor wrote:
On the potions thing, that really just boils down to potions being a crappy means of crafting.
I'd say not so much "crappy" as "low-budget." Potions are supposed to be the low-end enchantments that you find by the case at "Gold Piece Store," labelled in Infernal, and two aeons beyond their expiration date.
Orfamay Quest wrote: Drachasor wrote:
On the potions thing, that really just boils down to potions being a crappy means of crafting.
I'd say not so much "crappy" as "low-budget." Potions are supposed to be the low-end enchantments that you find by the case at "Gold Piece Store," labelled in Infernal, and two aeons beyond their expiration date.
Wondrous Items can be low budget. Scrolls can be low budget. They aren't forced to be just low-budget stuff though.
There's a reason why people say it isn't worth a feat. Brew Potion is pretty darn terrible.
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