The 9th level oracle in my group wants to craft a Minor Rod of Quicken which states it has a CL of 17.
So let me start by saying that I know that the CL given on an item is not a requirement the creator must meet, and pretty much only used for seeing how difficult it is to dispel.
However, what I wonder is the CL of the resulting rod (and with it the DC to craft it in the first place). Is the CL 9 (and the DC 19, +5 for missing Quicken Spell) or 17 (DC 27 then) ?
Use the listed book CL for the spellcraft check (DC 27).
Just because the crafter cannot or chooses not to make the item at the specified CL doesn't mean the item gets easier to make. Otherwise, this becomes a cheese loophole for crafting every magic item at CL 1 (even the ones that DO have a required CL since you could just make it at CL 1 and add +5 to the DC for missing that requirement too) to reduce the cost and make sure you can always succeed without having to max your Spellcraft skill.
It should be a DC 27 if he/she has all the requirements.
I my campaigns I don't let any one buy or create anything that is worth (cost to purchase not to create)half their wealth by level.
WBL for a 9th level character is 46,000 gp
So...
the highest valued magic item they could buy is 23,000 gp
the highest valued magic item they could craft is 11,500 gp
pg 400 CRB third paragraph down in the left column is a nice guideline
Use the listed book CL for the spellcraft check (DC 27).
Just because the crafter cannot or chooses not to make the item at the specified CL doesn't mean the item gets easier to make. Otherwise, this becomes a cheese loophole for crafting every magic item at CL 1 (even the ones that DO have a required CL since you could just make it at CL 1 and add +5 to the DC for missing that requirement too) to reduce the cost and make sure you can always succeed without having to max your Spellcraft skill.
Also like to add this from the the CRB:
For potions, scrolls, and wands, the creator can set the
caster level of an item at any number high enough to cast
the stored spell but not higher than her own caster level. For
other magic items, the caster level is determined by the item
itself. In this case, the creator’s caster level must be as high as
the item’s caster level (and prerequisites may effectively put a
higher minimum on the creator’s level).
As we're on this topic, I have a doubt as well:
Let's say that my 6th level wizard wanted to create a +3 Cloak of Resistance. One of the requisites to make it is that he need to have a caster level equal to at least three times the bonus, so I don't meet the requirement, ok?
So, in Core, p. 549, it says that you can atempt to make an item that you don't have a prerequisite, increasing the DC by 5, correct?
Does that mean that, if he wanted, at level 6, to create an +4 Cloak, the DC would be the same? Or it will be higher?
The Item's CL will be your level, 6, since that is all you can do.
The spellcraft DC will use the minimum required caster level even though you are not high enough. So the +4 cloak will have a spellcraft DC of 22 (5 +12 +5 for not having the minimum CL). It will still cost you 8,000 gold to craft it and 16 days.
So, the DC to craft an +3, +4 or +5 item is the same? That does not seems fair
So, the DC to craft an +3, +4 or +5 item is the same? That does not seems fair
For your level 6 wizard:
+3 cloak: Spellcraft DC = 19 (5 +9 +5 not having required CL)
+4 cloak: Spellcraft DC = 22 (5 +12 +5 not having required CL)
+5 cloak: Spellcraft DC = 25 (5 +15 +5 not having required CL)
Ah, ok. that makes sense
Also like to add this from the the CRB:
For potions, scrolls, and wands, the creator can set the
caster level of an item at any number high enough to cast
the stored spell but not higher than her own caster level. For
other magic items, the caster level is determined by the item
itself. In this case, the creator’s caster level must be as high as
the item’s caster level (and prerequisites may effectively put a
higher minimum on the creator’s level).
You might want to check a more current printing (or download a newer PDF):
Page 460—In the Magic Items Description section, under Caster Level, delete the last sentence of the second paragraph.
Also like to add this from the the CRB:
For potions, scrolls, and wands, the creator can set the
caster level of an item at any number high enough to cast
the stored spell but not higher than her own caster level. For
other magic items, the caster level is determined by the item
itself. In this case, the creator’s caster level must be as high as
the item’s caster level (and prerequisites may effectively put a
higher minimum on the creator’s level).You might want to check a more current printing (or download a newer PDF):
Page 460—In the Magic Items Description section, under Caster Level, delete the last sentence of the second paragraph.
Thanks Majuba - its true I have an older version (I think the original PDF)of the CRB. If I buy a new CRB PDF will it have all the erratas?
I bought the sixth printing of the CRB - Thanks so much!
Ah, I was actually wondering how that paragraph works with the whole "No, the CL is not a requirement". But if it's deleted that makes more sense now.
Still kinda weird that a Belt of Giant Strength +6 is CL 8 while one of Physical Might +2 (on two stats) is CL 12.
Still kinda weird that a Belt of Giant Strength +6 is CL 8 while one of Physical Might +2 (on two stats) is CL 12.
Well, it is and it isn't -- the stat blocks only show a single CL, even if there's multiple variations of an item. I generally assume that to be the highest level of the item in question. As it requires a Level 2 spell, that should be a CL 3 base, but for some reason they seem to like bumping up CLs beyond that for various reasons (e.g. "Caster must be twice the level of the bonus"). Se we'll assume the latter for a single stat, 3 times for two stats, and 4 times for three stats. So you have:
+2/4/6 to 1 Stat: CL 4/6/8
+2/4/6 to 2 Stats: CL 6/9/12
+2/4/6 to 3 Stats: CL 8/12/16
And that ends up inline with a lot of other magic item creation mechanics listed in other places, while also matching the final CLs listed for those items.
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I think most of the CLs are actually determined by "Gosh, a character with the money available to make this is probably high-level enough to Spellcraft it at such-and-so CL".
@OP: some clues about the DC for the rod might be found here:
Pearl of Power: What is the caster level required to create this item?
Though the listed Caster Level for a pearl of power is 17th, that caster level is not part of the Requirements listing for that item. Therefore, the only caster level requirement for a pearl of power is the character has to be able to cast spells of the desired level.
However, it makes sense that the minimum caster level of the pearl is the minimum caster level necessary to cast spells of that level--it would be strange for a 2nd-level pearl to be CL 1st.
For example, a 3rd-level wizard with Craft Wondrous Item can create a 1st-level pearl, with a minimum caster level of 1. He can set the caster level to whatever he wants (assuming he can meet the crafting DC), though the pearl's caster level has no effect on its powers (other than its ability to resist dispel magic). If he wants to make a 2nd-level pearl, the caster level has to be at least 3, as wizards can't cast 2nd-level spells until they reach character level 3. He can even try to make a 3rd-level pearl, though the minimum caster level is 5, and he adds +5 to the DC because he doesn't meet the "able to cast 3rd-level spells" requirement.
—Sean K Reynolds, 08/18/10 Back to Top