Armored arcane caster

[Jubal Breakbottle]

I just realized yesterday that witch hexes and the abilities of sorcerer and wizards are either spell-like, supernatural, or extraordinary abilities. So what? None of these abilities affect arcane spell failure.

What's the best arcane full caster can we build that primarily relies on their abilities (avoiding spell failure)? Some combat and utility spells could be cast with Still Spell. Other buff and utility spells could be cast without armor at camp. How does the build compare with a magus of equal level?

Also, arcane casters might not need armor proficiencies. They just need to minimize the armor class penalties for their rays and touch attacks. But they're still just hitting a touch AC.

Hmm.

My first idea was a gnome sorcerer with fell magic and marid bloodline. At 1st level, he gets chill touch once per day, a frost ray a few times per day, and Sotto Voce at will. At 4th level, he gets Blindness/Deafness. Then, at 9th level, he gets an adamantine, area of effect attack at will.

Cheers

[Conundrum]

Those abilities aren't unlimited use. Usually it's 3+ stat mod times per day.

[MrSin]

I would think a witch would be the best choice if you just wanted to focus on spamming an Su or spell like ability with a full casters. Lots of hexes to choose from and you can go combats without casting actual spells. Not the wisest choice, but neither is fitting into armor with a full arcane caster. Another choice is a wizard going into arcane signifier to cast in mithral hellknight plate with armor expert or sargavan guard and comfort armor quality to get 0 ACP.

[Marc Radle]

Well, unless you want to stick to Paizo classes only, I'd actually strongly suggest that the Battle Scion just might be exactly what you are looking for!

From the Product Info:
Lethal with Blade and Blast!

For years, Pathfinder Roleplaying Game fans have lamented the absence of an 'arcane paladin' type of class—one with full base attack bonus, heavy armor, limited spell access (to arcane spells instead of divine) and a set of interesting, flavorful special abilities.

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The Expanded Battle Scion includes:

- Force Blaster and Bonded Scion archetypes
- 5 new feats including Awakened Arcane Bond, which imbues your arcane bond object with intelligence and will
- A Prepared Spell Tracking Sheet, usable by any prepared spell caster
- New rules for legendary magic items, and 3 new items: the legendary shield, sword and armor of the first battle scion

If you dream of scattering your enemies with a powerful force attack before finishing them off with lethal bladework, New Paths #4: The Expanded Battle Scion is for you!

Check out the Battle Scion here

[Jubal Breakbottle]

Conundrum wrote:

Those abilities aren't unlimited use. Usually it's 3+ stat mod times per day.

Yes, the abilities have varying frequencies, but that 9th Marid bloodline power is at-will.

Water's Fury:

At 9th level, you gain the ability to summon a rushing jet of water from the elemental plane of water and direct it against your foes. As a standard action, you can create a jet of water in a 60-foot line that deals 1d6 points of damage per two sorcerer levels you possess, and blinds the target that was struck for 1d6 rounds. A Reflex save (DC 10 + 1/2 your sorcerer level + your Charisma bonus) reduces the damage by half and negates the blinding effect.

[Morgen]

I'll suggest Summoners. You are totally capable of taking one and building it with just throwing away it's spell casting for the most part. Build very martially and enjoy your cleric BAB and hit points in heavier armour while still being able to summon things.

[RainyDayNinja]

Uh-oh, you may have just given me the idea for my next character. Armored melee witch using hexes and non-somatic spells. Hmm...

[Jubal Breakbottle]

Let's see some builds. I think the benchmark is the magus to stay Paizo-only. Thanks Marc Radle.

[tomorrow]

Near as I can tell, without accounting for Patron Spells/Bloodline Spells or the use of the Still Spell feat, no somatic component spell list for Witch or Sorcerer seems to be:

Witch
0 - Light
1 – Command
2 – Blindness/Deafness, Steal Voice
3 – Lover’s Vengeance, Screech, Spit Venom, Suggestion, Tongues, Vision of Hell
4 – Communal Tongues, Dimension Door, Lesser Geas
5 – Contact Other Plane, Damnation Stride, Teleport, Truespeak
6 – Geas, Ice Crystal Teleport, Mass Suggestion, Unconscious Agenda
7 – Greater Teleport, Phase Door, Power Word Blind, Teleport Object
8 – Irresistible Dance, Mass Charm Monster, Nine Lives, Power Word Stun
9 – Power Word Kill, Teleport Circle, Wail of the Banshee

Sorcerer/Wizard
0 –Flare, Light, Sotto Voce
1 – Chastise, Feather Fall, Flare Burst, Hold Portal, Liberating Command, Lighten Object, True Strike, Ventriloquism,
2 – Blindness/Deafness, Blur, Bouyancy, Darkness, Knock, Steal Voice
3 – Displacement, Dweomer Retailation, Lover’s Vengeance, Suggestion, Tongues, Vision of Hell
4 – Communal Tongues, Dimension Door, Emergency Force Sphere, Lesser Geas, Shout,
5 – Contact Other Plane, Damnation Stride, Echolocation, Mass Lighten Object, Planar Adaptation, Teleport, Truespeak
6 – Geas, Ice Crystal Teleport, Mass Suggestion, Unconscious Agenda
7 – Greater Teleport, Phase Door, Power Word Blind, Resonating Word, Teleport Object
8 – Irresistible Dance, Mass Charm Monster, Nine Lives, Power Word Stun
9 – Fiery Body, Interplanetary Teleport, Mage’s Disjunction, Power Word Kill, Prismatic Sphere, Teleport Circle, Time Stop, Wail of the Banshee

If that helps anyone with builds. Of course basic utility cantrips are still available for both too, as arcane spell failure just means occasional additional castings before said cantrips work.

[RainyDayNinja]

Yeah, I was looking into that, and the witch idea doesn't sound so great. They don't really have any non-somatic self-buffs other than the Fortune hex.

[Artanthos]

Jubal Breakbottle wrote:

Let's see some builds. I think the benchmark is the magus to stay Paizo-only. Thanks Marc Radle.

Or the hellknight signifier.

[Marc Radle]

Jubal Breakbottle wrote:

I think the benchmark is the magus to stay Paizo-only. Thanks Marc Radle.

Too bad, I hear the Battle Scion is a pretty darn good class ;)

[Indagare]

I've never quite understood the arcane spell failure, since most of the somatic gestures mentioned do not seem to involve doing the "Macarena" or similarly complex acts. Generally they seem to be hand gestures, which at worse would mean no gloves/gauntlets.

I guess my advice would simply be to homebrew it out: casters still have to learn how to use arms and armor (they aren't fighters, after all), but there's no penalty for using/wearing armor.

[Kydeem de'Morcaine]

RainyDayNinja wrote:

Uh-oh, you may have just given me the idea for my next character. Armored melee witch using hexes and non-somatic spells. Hmm...

I believe there is a build somewhere int the forums for a witch using folding plate (to store while buffing), then hexes and the few non-som spells for attacks.