Eldritch Knight+Magus


Rules Questions


First of all, this question is really two parted:

firstly, the EK class ability 'Spells per day' states the following:
"At the indicated levels, an eldritch
knight gains new spells per day as if he had also gained a
level in an arcane spellcasting class he belonged to before
adding the prestige class. He does not, however, gain any
other benefit a character of that class would have gained,
except for additional spells per day, spells known (if he
is a spontaneous spellcaster), and an increased effective
level of spellcasting. If a character had more than
one arcane spellcasting class before becoming an
eldritch knight, he must decide to which class he
adds the new level for purposes of determining spells
per day."

that being said, when taking levels in EK after being any arcane class, would your level of spells increase according to your base class? example: if i am a level 7th level sorcerer i can only cast up to 3rd level spells. if i take a level in Eldritch Knight when i level up, would i then be able to cast 4th level spells?

the line stating "and an increased effective level of spellcasting." is highly unclear on this. my interpretation is that "Increased level of spellcasting" simply means caster level. however my friend who plays in my current campaign with me suggests that it encompasses pretty much everything to do with leveling up as a caster except the class abilities as it states in the (-).

Part 2 of the question is an epic level ruling question: if a 20th level Magus takes levels in EK, would he increase his level of spells castable as the above noted sorcerer (assuming the answer to part 1 is a yes)? and if so, would you use 7th,8th, and 9th level arcane spells from the current sorc/wizard spell list as magus spells, or would you create new spells of those levels specifically for the magus as you do with 10th+ level spells for the sorc/wizard when they advance beyond 20th level?


Yes, it would increase according to base class, though you should note that EK 1 does not increase casting. So by your example, a Sorc 7 / EK 1 would cast as a 7th level Sorc, but a Sorc 7 / EK 2 would cast as an 8th level Sorc. Your Bloodline would not level though by taking EK. Also note that by RAW, prepared casters like the Wizard and Magus would not get free spells known through EK as it specifies that only spontaneous casters do; they have to buy them and add them to their spellbook.

"Increased effective level of casting" = Caster level only.

As for epic level, your group has to figure that out. There is no Paizo support for epic.


chaoseffect wrote:

Yes, it would increase according to base class, though you should note that EK 1 does not increase casting. So by your example, a Sorc 7 / EK 1 would cast as a 7th level Sorc, but a Sorc 7 / EK 2 would cast as an 8th level Sorc. Your Bloodline would not level though by taking EK. Also note that by RAW, prepared casters like the Wizard and Magus would not get free spells known through EK as it specifies that only spontaneous casters do; they have to buy them and add them to their spellbook.

"Increased effective level of casting" = Caster level only.

As for epic level, your group has to figure that out. There is no Paizo support for epic.

thank you for responding, but you actually didn't answer the question.

if "Increased effective level of casting" = Caster level only. , then you would never gain the ability to use 4th level spells. you would be a sorc7/EK2 with a caster level of 9 and an arsenal of spells with 3rd level and below in it. increasing caster level does not grant access to higher level spells.

and just FYI, the core rulebook has support for Epic level...


Really? I never saw that in the Core Rule Book. I just knew that Paizo expressed disinterest in it for the most part. Sorry can't help ya there as I never even knew it existed.

I thought I did answer it, but I'm sorry if it wasn't as clear as I meant it to be; a Sorc 7 / EK 2 has identical spell casting to Sorc 8. This would include all the spell slots and spells known of a Sorc 8 (which would include 4th level spells).

Increased effective level of casting = caster level
Additional spells per day = access to higher tier spells

Together (plus the spells known clause for spontaneous casters) means that each time the prestige says it increases casting, you essentially act as though your previous spell casting class went up a level regarding spells.

Also EK does not give increased casting on EK 1, so your Sorc casting would always be one level behind.

Grand Lodge

Page 406 and 407 sort of touch on the idea of Epic levels.

Nothing really concrete.

Liberty's Edge

The Sorcerer 7 / Eldritch Knight 2 would have 4th level spells. When you get +1 level of casting you advance everything casting related, except prepared casters don't gain their 2 automatic spells per level. (According to RAW at least, most DMs let them have their 2 spells.)

The epic level magus would not gain access to the spells from the sorcerer / wizard list but would instead use his higher level slots to memorize spells from his own class list with metamagic built in.

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