Paladins, and Gods.


Rules Questions


Can a Paladin worship science?

If a Paladin is under the mistaken belief that he is a god, can he worship himself as a god?

If someone -is- a God, like Thor or Zeus, can they be Paladins of themselves?

If a Paladin's god dies, are they still a Paladin, or just a knight?

If a Paladin catches his own god breaking his laws, is a Paladin obligated to smite his own god in the name of his god?

If a Paladin's mount becomes intelligent or 'awakened', does he have to try and convert his mount? If it doesn't work, does he have to get a new mount?

The same above, but if the Paladin has an intelligent weapon?

If a sinner becomes a Paladin, and then goes back in time and encounters himself as a sinner, is he obligated to smite himself?

That plate mail is pretty cool, huh?

This is all for now.


In Golarion I think they must choose a deity. By the core rules they don't have to choose one.


8 people marked this as a favorite.

I feel that I am very qualified to answer these questions; indeed, I may be the most qualified on the boards!

Vamptastic wrote:
Can a Paladin worship science?

What is this "science" of which you speak? The only thing I worship is my god! It is everything in life. Serving your god is what makes you a paladin!

Vamptastic wrote:
If a Paladin is under the mistaken belief that he is a god, can he worship himself as a god?

Obviously, believing yourself to be a god is not a good thing to do, nor is it very lawful, as you're just making your own rules! And we all know how chaotic that is. Besides, there are no rules covering this, and thus, to do it would be breaking the rules--just ask the people on these forums. At least some of them would agree with me! It is breaking the rules, and as such is an unlawful act, and as such is immediate grounds to fall.

Vamptastic wrote:
If someone -is- a God, like Thor or Zeus, can they be Paladins of themselves?

That's a tougher one. Being that they are gods, I can't disagree with what they have to say, unless they're a non-Lawful-Good god, in which case, I DISAGREE. As for a Lawful Good deity, I suppose they could be a paladin. It's when they start casting miracle spells that things get really wonky.

Vamptastic wrote:
If a Paladin's god dies, are they still a Paladin, or just a knight?

If you want to be "just a knight," then you should be a cavalier, or a fighter, neither of which has the holy smiting power and sheer honor and drive for JUSTICE that a paladin has. As long as you continue to fight for justice and honor and everything that is good in the world, NO MATTER THE ODDS, you will retain paladin-y-ness! May I fall if I am wrong! (Of course, I took the Absolute Loyalty trait, so I can atone as a last resort. I'm telling you in full disclosure so it can't be construed that I misled you, as that would make me fall.)

Vamptastic wrote:
If a Paladin catches his own god breaking his laws, is a Paladin obligated to smite his own god in the name of his god?

Another tricky question! Obviously a paladin would only smite an evildoer, after having detected them as such. And obviously, a paladin's god would never be evil, as we only worship gods of goodness and/or lawfulness, and NEVER evil ones. Of course, if a paladin ever knowingly commits an evil act, he falls... So, does a god do the same? I would say no! Gods follow different rules from we mortals. I might put in a word about my feelings on the matter, but any more and I might fall for impudence, which is always not lawful.

...You're trying to trip me up, aren't you?

Vamptastic wrote:
If a Paladin's mount becomes intelligent or 'awakened', does he have to try and convert his mount? If it doesn't work, does he have to get a new mount?

Any paladin worth his aura of justice already has a mount that fully worships his deity. In fact, the mount is a gift from the gods! But, if, in some odd case, the mount did become awakened and turn from the paladin's god, it would depend more on alignment. After all, paladins can travel with lawful good cohorts of any religion! But not overly smarmy ones, or ones who tell too many jokes.

Vamptastic wrote:
The same above, but if the Paladin has an intelligent weapon?

I would believe it would be more or less the same case.

Vamptastic wrote:
If a sinner becomes a Paladin, and then goes back in time and encounters himself as a sinner, is he obligated to smite himself?

Yes, of course! If he were evil at the time, at least. Look, a paladin needs to be detecting evil, to put it in the vernacular, "all day, erry day." And if his Justice Sense ever pings, he needs to smite instantly, or else it is cowardice and he falls. If it requires smiting himself, then yes, he must do so. However, this could create a paradox, which would break the laws of time, which is unlawful, which would cause the paladin to fall. Hard and fast ruling? DON'T TRAVEL IN TIME, as this is unlawful and causes you to fall.

Vamptastic wrote:
That plate mail is pretty cool, huh?

Strictly speaking, it's either plate or mail, not both. But it's actually rather hot under here, especially when you're out under the sun--which is the main place Paladins are allowed to be, really, as going in the dark for any reason other than bringing light to it and smiting the evildoers hiding there is rather sketchy.

Good luck, and MAY JUSTICE ALWAYS BE WITH YOU!
*Strikes out across the sunlit plain to spread the word of Justice and Honor and all things Good to the heathen masses*


@The Lawful Stupid Paladin

Best
Post
Ever
lol :)

Shadow Lodge

Vamptastic wrote:

Can a Paladin worship science?

If a Paladin is under the mistaken belief that he is a god, can he worship himself as a god?

Outside Golarion and PFS there is no requirement that a paladin have a god - they get their powers from the forces of Law and Good. Worshiping science or yourself is not necessarily incompatible with Law and Good, so it would be allowed if your GM says it is. Personally I would want to hear the specific concept since worship of self is often incompatible with the LG alignment which is more selfless, and science is supposed to be a mental discipline, not an object of worship.

Vamptastic wrote:
If someone -is- a God, like Thor or Zeus, can they be Paladins of themselves?

I think Iomedae would be described as such - IIRC she was a paladin as a mortal.

Vamptastic wrote:

If a Paladin's god dies, are they still a Paladin, or just a knight?

If a Paladin catches his own god breaking his laws, is a Paladin obligated to smite his own god in the name of his god?

Since the paladin's alignment comes before their god, and the paladin doesn't actually derive power from their god, they remain paladins if their god dies and though I don't think they're required to actually smite their god for non-LG behavior (if the deity in question is NG or LN), they are required to put the paladin's code and LG behavior before the specific dictates of their god.

Vamptastic wrote:

If a Paladin's mount becomes intelligent or 'awakened', does he have to try and convert his mount? If it doesn't work, does he have to get a new mount?

The same above, but if the Paladin has an intelligent weapon?

The mount is in fact always awakened - they have Int 6. They are also assumed to be loyal to the paladin's cause/faith because they are a part of the paladin's bond with the divine.

A weapon would be more like an ally - the paladin isn't required to convert it. However, note that an intelligent weapon wielded by a paladin is probably LG (though it could also be LN or LG) since if you don't match your intelligent item's alignment you get negative levels.

Vamptastic wrote:
If a sinner becomes a Paladin, and then goes back in time and encounters himself as a sinner, is he obligated to smite himself?

Most paladins are allowed to show mercy to evildoers/sinners who they have reason to believe can be redeemed. Since the paladin has reason to believe that their past selves can be redeemed, they don't have to smite themselves. They would do well however to try and keep their past selves headed in the direction of redemption, and to minimize any harm done by their past selves.


These answers were very helpful. Thank you.

I did not know that about Paladin's mounts.


Actually, for Golarion, paladins don't have to have a deity.

PFS requires them to choose a deity, but just being part of the Golarion canon does not.

James Jacobs in one of his posts about paladins and deities.

Shadow Lodge

Sniggevert wrote:

Actually, for Golarion, paladins don't have to have a deity.

PFS requires them to choose a deity, but just being part of the Golarion canon does not.

James Jacobs in one of his posts about paladins and deities.

Thanks, I don't play in Golarion myself and occasionally mix up PFS stuff with Golarion stuff.

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Rules Questions / Paladins, and Gods. All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.