| mjmeans |
Advanced Race Guide section on Race Builder - Racial Qualities - Type Quality - paragraph 4 says that the subtype applies to racial traits, explicitly stating the example that "you must have the ratfolk subtype to take the rodent empathy racial trait". Under the ratfolk section in the same book, the rodent empathy trait is indeed a racial trait, not a race trait. Race traits actually being a character trait from the race trait sub-list.
Couple that example with the fact that the half-elf race is defined as race: half-elf, subtype: human. So it seems the half-elf race should be able to pick racial traits (racial abilities) from both the half-elf and human racial traits lists.
If my logic is correct that would mean that a half-elf can choose to not take Multitalented and instead take Bonus Feat.
Is this in fact RAW?
| Kazaan |
That's when it comes to building a race from scratch. If you were to build a race and included the rodent empathy racial trait, your race would also require the ratfolk subtype. It doesn't apply to cherry-picking racial traits from an already existing race like Human and grafting them onto another already existing race like Half-Elf. Your argument is invalid.
| Pupsocket |
Then is there any explicitly defined RAW game effect at all of half-elves being listed as subtype human?
Favored Enemy: Humanoid (Human)
| mjmeans |
Yeah... So not exactly answering my last question. I'm looking for a rule that says "racial subtype is ...", and the only thing I can find says it is used SOMETIMES to qualify for prerequisites. That seems to state that it would have to be specifically mentioned in the special quality to be applicable to both the race and racial subtype, for the subtype to be relevant.
"Favored Enemy (Ex): At 1st level, a ranger selects a creature type from the ranger favored enemies table."
It doesn't say anything about racial subtype. The table lists favored enemies type (subtype) which are "creature" type and subtype, not "race" type and "racial" subtype. And there is nothing I can find that equates, "creature subtype" to "racial subtype". Since they're different words, they are different meanings.
| Kazaan |
Racial subtype is creature subtype for Humanoid races. A Half-Elf is Humanoid(Human, Elf) while an Elf is Humanoid(Elf). A Drow is also Humanoid(Elf) so if a Ranger had Favored Enemy [Humanoid(Elf)], it'd count vs Half-Elves, Elves, Drow, Drow Nobles, and any other race that can be concocted with the ARG that has the type(subtype) of Humanoid(Elf(,<other subtype(s)>)). But an Elf can't take a Drow Racial Trait like Spell Resistance or Poison Use because it's a pre-built race. Now, if you want to use the ARG to design a race of Elves (or Orcs, Goblins, Dwarves, Toodlyflobpies, or whatever) that has the same Bonus Feat Racial Trait that Core Humans have, you can do that. You can name your race whatever you want, though you might want to name it something different from a Core race if it shares a subtype with said Core Race (ie. don't name your custom Dwarves "Dwarves", name them "Dwemer"). If you look at the ARG under Race Builder> Feats & Skills and find the Flexible Bonus Feat Racial Trait, you'll find that the Prerequisites are listed as none, not Human. You'll find that with most Racial Traits, there are no prerequisites. That doesn't mean you can freely modify any race with a Racial Trait just because it has no prerequisite. It means that if you're constructing a race from scratch, you can put that trait on without considering restrictions beyond how many RP you're allowing for the race.
| mjmeans |
Okay. That clears it up. Thanks. The current version of PCGen has a problem then when it comes to Character (Race) Traits in general as it applies to Half-Elves (and possibly Half-Orcs too) and the Adopted social trait in specific which PCGen incorrectly enables picking a Racial Trait from another race instead of a Character (Race) Trait from another race. I've been on the PCGen development list before, so I'll let them know.