I'll admit that I have seen some poorly built, and even more poorly played rogues. I think a lot of people have this idea that you have to come out of stealth in order to get sneak attacks (I wonder where ANYONE would get that silly idea?).
Okay, so I come out of stealth behind them, get my stun off, hit a backstab, flip around in front to stun them again, hook behind them again for another backstab, then use my five points to trigger my Eviscerate finisher and DIE NIGHT ELF DIE--
WoW can be good for instilling the ethic of studying your build in order to get better at playing it, but man is it bad for teaching rogues how to learn to Sneak Attack in Pathfinder.
To be fair, DnD doesn't have a mechanic for rogues that emulates premeditation, combo points, kidney shot, ambush, or my favorite Killing Spree! At least we have hermorrage? Rogues with the power to teleport around and get full attacks off does sound pretty snazzy though.
I see where people are coming from with not playing rogue. Its actually really friendly and wanting them not to run into trouble. We can talk about that after they experience pathfinder a little more. I thought it was overwhelming when I first started to play the game and it took me some time to look at mechanics instead of labels. Personally my rogue of choice is a swordsage... but I don't think pathfinder does that gig.
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To be fair, DnD doesn't have a mechanic for rogues that emulates premeditation, combo points, kidney shot, ambush, or my favorite Killing Spree! At least we have hermorrage? Rogues with the power to teleport around and get full attacks off does sound pretty snazzy though.
I see where people are coming from with not playing rogue. Its actually really friendly and wanting them not to run into trouble. We can talk about that after they experience pathfinder a little more. I thought it was overwhelming when I first started to play the game and it took me some time to look at mechanics instead of labels. Personally my rogue of choice is a swordsage... but I don't think pathfinder does that gig.
As a GM last week, I had two rogues in my game. I sort of nudged them into flanking once or twice, and then they began doing it automatically. I think that one of the roles of the GM is to help players be better players. I don't go for the adversarial GM thing... I also don't pull punches. If I'm playing intelligent enemies, I am definitely going to be flanking them, so they should be flanking me, too!
I thought it was overwhelming when I first started to play the game and it took me some time to look at mechanics instead of labels.
THIS
I agree that some other classes with archtypes can do sneaking, trap finding, archery, and TWF better.
But I think one of the suggestions had stuff from 4 different books (I believe none of which the OP has) and was combining 2 different archtypes (experienced players get confused combining archtypes) which don't even exist in the CRB.
I would have to page back and read all of them again to be sure it was this and not another thread.
If you don't play up, have 5 or 6 people at the table, and you tell them you are new. You will usually be fine even if your rogue isn't great. people will help suggest what you likely can or can't do, what would be good to buy, where to move, when to run away, etc...
It is like playing with training wheels. I think the rogue would do fine. And what if after playing 3 sessions and talking with others, the OP wants a ranger? Well, he comes back posts the question and we help him build a ranger.
Rogues may not be the must-have class they once were, but the rogue can still perform his function of trapspringer and scout. He has a role to play in the party, and he's good at it.There are classes that do both, at the same time, better.
Never said they couldn't, but (unlike the monk) the rogue can DO his stated job competently, is the point I'm making.
Again, it is someone new to the game with the CRB.
An archtype of a complicated class from a book he doesn't have is not a kind suggestion.
So do I.
But it doesn't have the trap finding he wanted without an archtype, to which he doesn't have access.
It doesn't have quite as many skills, gets evasion much later, some people really like the rogue talents, and many people love the sudden damage spike when you get a sneak attack.
So I can see why many like playing the rogue.