Melee healer Cleric help wanted

[Conundrum]

I have made afew clerics in the past couple years, and have yet to find a decent balance for melee and channeling/healing/condition removal. Is it possible to make a Badass melee cleric that can do well at the other stuff or is the concept too spread out? Also, don't care for Oracles or level dips so that could make the endeavor more difficult.

[Wasum]

just dont focus on healing at all. Play smart. Heal after combat.

[Rashagar]

Relying on having reach and taking advantage of attacks of opportunity, and having the quick channel as a move action feat can help a lot when you're trying to do everything with a cleric.

There are also little tricks like the quicken spell like ability feat for some of the domain powers. Think you have to be 11th level for that or something though.

[Conundrum]

AoO, mm. Might mean investing a bit into dex and going combat reflexes. Reach, thinking Halberd or hardcore scoot now we are chewing they feats. Hmm. Seems like it should be possible yet...?

[Strannik]

I'm actually playing a reach cleric right now and it's working quite well, only made it to level 6 so far, but it just keeps getting better.

Here's a link to a guide I found quite handy.

I typically get several AoO in a round and mainly cast buffing spells in combat.

I would agree w/ Wasum, it's typically not worth healing in combat. A wand of cure light goes a long way. :)

[master_marshmallow]

paladin of sarenrae can grab dervish dance and skip out on STR, but it takes 2 feats

tho, normally i see a lot of people taking heavy armor proficiency, so if you're gonna burn a feat anyway and you want to be able to balance your stats better it might be worth looking into
build would look something like:

Human Cleric of Sarenrae
20 point buy
STR 7
DEX 15
CON 12
INT 10
WIS 16(+2 race)
CHA 14

dervish dance lets you forgo STR all together, you will just have a reduced carrying capacity, but you have BDF's for that

higher DEX means you can maximize your use of medium armor, and dont have to waste that feat on heavy armor proficiency

feats:
1) Weapon Finesse, Fast Learner
3) Dervish Dance
5) Selective Channeling
7) Quick Channeling
9) Extra Channeling

there are a bunch of other routes to go with it, this is just based on channeling, this feat here has questionable legality, but its really good as written originally, since you can just use spark over and over and get free heals going

[DrDeth]

I like the Hospitaler Paladin. Starting after 4th level spend a feat for selective channel, then extra channel, later Quick Channeling that makes channeling a move action.

This gives you your human, 1 & 3 feats for toughness, power attack, and maybe even more lay on hands.

This build allows you to get in there and really hit hard in melee and heal yourself with a swift.

You can heal others with either lay on hands or the whole party with channel.

And yes, Healing during combat can be important. James Jacobs sez so.

Mind you a wand for topping off after the battle is a good investment.

But yes, reach cleric or Marshmallows dervish cleric are both good.

[master_marshmallow]

i meant to say cleric, idk why i thought paladin....

[Heaggles]

Warship the god of war you get to use a 2 handed sword :p

[master_marshmallow]

Heaggles wrote:

Warship the god of war you get to use a 2 handed sword :p

gotta burn a feat on heavy armor that way, or play in a 40 point buy

its great for damage, if you're the only damager out there, but if thats the case why play a cleric?

but in reality, battle clerics based off gorum cant really do much with channeling and healing which is what OP asked about, because you have to dedicate resources to other things

example:
STR 16
DEX 12
CON 12
INT 10
WIS 14
CHA 11

spellcasting gets diminished, channeling is basically non-existant beyond the 3 you get from your class

unless you dump INT which is bad for clerics because you want skills, is there an archetype that gives them 4+INT/level like the fighter Lore Master?

best race for this build is imo versatile human, putting a bonus into STR and WIS, but the overall need for good stats kills the class imo if you wanna focus on more than one thing, or not focus and generalize

[Rory]

Conundrum wrote:

I have made afew clerics in the past couple years, and have yet to find a decent balance for melee and channeling/healing/condition removal. Is it possible to make a Badass melee cleric that can do well at the other stuff or is the concept too spread out? Also, don't care for Oracles or level dips so that could make the endeavor more difficult.

S: 16 D: 10 C: 13 I: 10 W: 16 Ch: 12 (20 pt build, half-orc)

.
Domain/Sub-Domain: Erastil
- Plant/Growth (ability to enlarge person yourself 3+WIS times per day as a swift action, gives you a nifty damage shield at level 6)
- Animal/Fur (gives you a +10 ft movement speed burst, gain an animal companion at level 4 for more melee action)

Feats:
Weapon Focus: Great Axe (level 1)
Power Attack (level 3)
Boon Companion (level 5)

Items:
Great Axe
Breastplate

Spells:
1st: Bless, Divine Favor, Cause Fear (low levels)
2nd: Bull's Strength, Weapon of Awe, Sound Burst
3rd: Prayer
4th: Blessing of Fervor

Melee Strategy:

A great axe with Enlarge Person will be doing 3d6+6 damage per hit. You can boost to hit and/or damage with Bless, Divine Favor, Magic Weapon, Bull's Strength, etc.

You'll be low on AC, but you'll be able to heal yourself too. A bit risky, but you'll be a bruiser healer. +1 CON at level 4 and picking Toughness at level 5 should really shore this up.

You can use a Wand of Enlarge Person. Keep one handy.

Healing Strategy:

You'll have 4 Channels per day to heal. You'll have your spells too. That gives you lots of healing access.

Pick up Wands of Cure Light Wounds to assist healing. Keep a couple of Scrolls of Lesser Restoration in the backpack for emergencies. Scrolls or ailment curing are your friend.

Casting Strategy:

You are only down 1 DC from an 18 WIS starting cleric. That ain't shabby. Cast spells with impunity still for whatever purpose.

Alternative:

Drop Wis to 14 and raise Dex to 14. Go Human and pick up the Combat Reflexes feat and use a Long Spear. You'll have a better AC, a still nice 2d6+6 attack when enlarged, and have a tremendous threat range.

[Conundrum]

that last one I like a lot! I agree Marshmallow.

[master_marshmallow]

the half-orc one there is actually not legal because weapon focus requires BAB +1, which you dont have at lvl 1, replace it with heavy armor proficiency and you have a somewhat decent build
half-orc im guessing is chosen for weapon proficiency?

could carbon copy the build for a versatile human cleric of gorum and boost WIS on top of that stat array, and use a greatsword instead of a greataxe

that said, you're channeling still isnt the greatest, but its solid

[Conundrum]

was going to suggest swapping 1St and 3rd but that doesn't work either. Shoot.

[master_marshmallow]

nab heavy armor proficiency, its worth it

[Rory]

master_marshmallow wrote:

the half-orc one there is actually not legal because weapon focus requires BAB +1, which you dont have at lvl 1, replace it with heavy armor proficiency and you have a somewhat decent build

half-orc im guessing is chosen for weapon proficiency?

could carbon copy the build for a versatile human cleric of gorum and boost WIS on top of that stat array, and use a greatsword instead of a greataxe

that said, you're channeling still isnt the greatest, but its solid

Oops... Replace Weapon Focus with whatever...

Toughness wouldn't be bad. Pick Heavy Weapon Proficiency if desired, or Extra Channeling if more healing is preferred.

Half-Orc gives the weapon proficiencies. It also gives nice dark vision, and most importantly Orc Feroicity (which is great in the hands of a cleric).

Alas, you can't carbon copy the build as a human cleric of Gorum because the same domains aren't available to Gorum. You'd lose out on swift action Enlarge Person, which is a big component of the "melee cleric" side. Without that, you'd be stuck with 1 round casting time for Enlarge Person (if you can even get it with Gorum's domains).

[Conundrum]

Enlarge is full round? My system fu is truly weak, I never in all this time noticed that.

[Rory]

Conundrum wrote:

Enlarge is full round? My system fu is truly weak, I never in all this time noticed that.

Worse. It's "1 round".

That means you start casting, paint yourself a target until your turn comes up next round, and complete the spell then. Scrolls and Wands of Enlarge Person also take "1 round".

You can quaff Potions of Enlarge Person in a standard action though.