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....if not a humanoid. Dun, dun, dun! *resurrects stuff all over the place*
I've read some posts on vaguely related issues but they are fairly specific to certain outsider types. I also failed to see many options presented in those posts (which are mostly old now). So here I hope to explore some options so that there can be a reference point that can be used by others, regardless of what kind of non-humanoid they wish to enlarge.
I'll be blunt. I have a summoner and he has an eidolon (duh). I am not learning the spell enlarge person (although I could if absolutely necessary). I want my eidolon to become huge but lack the 10 evolution points to make it so. I fully intend to somehow take the monster feat 'Snatch' which requires being huge.
Juggernauts Pauldrons seemed the perfect way to go here since it treats the wearer (once activated) as though affected by an enlarge person spell. Then, as I paid more attention, I realized, well, my eidolon is a large outsider- it can't be targeted by the spell- but wait! If it is being AFFECTED by it, the targeting issue is bypassed. Yay!
The the first line in the spells description smacked me in the face, stating that 'a humanoid this and a humanoid that'. So even if the eidolon (or any outsider) were under the effects, the effects wouldn't affect them since they only apply to humanoids.
So I began looking at ways to make ANY nonhumanoid larger. Magic items, custom magic item options, whatever it takes without bending over too far backward to do it. Sure a custom spell could work, maybe a customized enlarge (non person) that is placed in juggernauts pauldrons instead. But besides going that route I tried getting creative by:
Using an item of alter self to qualify as a humanoid then being enlarged: This works fine if you're a tiefling or something where you are medium sized anyway, alter into a medium sized humanoid and then get enlarged. This does not work so well on any non-humanoid that is already large, attempting to get larger.
Using Righteous Might in an item (has to be permanent, or darn near permanent).
Thought about Ring of Continuation but this has two restrictions (three) which have to be bypassed and considered. First: You have to cast the spell. This is problematic for say an eidolon unless you've got UMD and a scroll or the like. Second: The spells duration has to be 10 minutes per level or better. This disqualifies a few immediate ways to get larger. Third: You have to make sure that you have all of your other qualifying buffs on first and apply the qualifying size increasing one last or its duration gets returned to normal and your last buff becomes extended to 24 hours.
Finally, this was the only sure fire way to do it with my person problem (described above). Enlarge person myself, apply to eidolon. Cast Permanency on enlarge person spell. Problem solved.
So, what other methods are there (I don't know divine spells very well) for increasing the size of something that isn't a humanoid for a long period of time?
I'm assuming wish is another option (I wish that So and So would increase in size by one size category when they so command until their next command of the same and that the ability to command themselves to increase in size would be a permanent ability of theirs requiring them only to choose a command word and speak it for the effect to take place).
And leave the details of the size increase to the GM to keep the effect balanced (ie, size increase as enlarge person or as legitimately having increased like a monster, gaining natural armor, etc). I'd feel that asking for the better version of size increase (especially with it being on command) would result in the wish needing to be much more airtight and complex. But this is wish...and at this point, the game is ending (possibly).
Mostly you've got to pay the evolution points, or use Enlarge Person and Permanency.
Righteous Might is a 5th level divine rounds/level spell; you're not likely to be able to get that on a permanent basis as an arcane caster (I probably wouldn't allow it without a huge cost, probably well outside of the kind of games I run). Ring of Continuation won't help due to the restriction on minimum duration.
I'd probably allow Wish to apply the Advanced template in some fashion, but not give you or your eidolon the permanent ability to change size. Wish isn't omnipotent; its constraints are pretty well laid out.
have an ifrit friend with the enlarge/reduce person spell-like?
yea, otherwise you probably looking at a crafted spell (Enlarge Monster level 3 or 4, etc etc...)
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Size increases don't stack, except in a few very specific cases. If your Eidolon, for the sake of argument, was a Humanoid, and you cast Enlarge Person on it, and it had the Large evolution, it would still be Large sized.
The only option to get a Huge Eidolon is to take the Huge evolution. I am unaware of any spell that can simply bump an Outsider up a size category (Enlarge Person specifically makes the target Large sized), but if you can get someone to cast Strong Jaw on it, the particular Natural attack that has been buffed will act as if it were a Natural attack 2 sizes larger.
Additionally, EVEN IF your Eidolon could get made Huge by casting a spell on it while Large sized to become Huge sized, it wouldn't get all the benefits of the Huge evolution. It'd likely get a +2 Strength increase, and very little else, if anything.
wait a minute,
a summoner can cast enlarge person on his eidolon.
enlarge increases size by 1 step.
and if you dont want to learn, seems a scroll would work just fine.
The summoner may cast a spell with a target of “you” on his eidolon (as a spell with a range of touch) instead of on himself. A summoner may cast spells on his eidolon even if the spells normally do not affect creatures of the eidolon’s type (outsider). Spells cast in this way must come from the summoner spell list.
This ability does not allow the eidolon to share abilities that are not spells, even if they function like spells.
what part says they cannot?
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http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/combat/space-reach-threatened-area-te mplates
tall creatures that are huge have reach 15. Don't think they intended enlarge person to be cast on large things, so they didnt specify that part.
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Right Seranov. Enlarge Person WOULD work. I am merely trying to get to huge. I don't really need the +8 str and +4 con and such (though that would all be nice). I simply need to qualify for the Snatch feat and for the theme of 'hey look at me, I'm big. No, really big'.
@Soulgambit that is EXACTLY where my mind was heading to next. FleshWarping poisons...but then that requires me to find a monster with a size changing ability...or shapechanging so it can qualify as humanoid and then benefit from the Pauldrons when enlarge person goes off. And man are those poisons SUPER expensive.
PS. What did you mean by the poison being able to technically do it and about getting it ok'd? Details man! :)
Would be nice if Use Magic Device sadly only let you pretend to be a human and be done with it. But that's not quite how it works. *Sigh*
can cast from scroll without UMD. but, would need a permancy to use it for a feat....
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Yeah, that was the plan. Snatch is a late game Awesome Blow + Grab Evolution combo for me (And better than both).
And it is relatively cheap to cast Permanency on Enlarge Person, so the easiest way, it seems to pull all of this off would simply be for a summoner to cast enlarge person on his eidolon and make it permanent (once the eidolon is large).
As for making a ranger/druid/cavaliers animal companion/mount larger, or increasing the size of a familiar or other outsider via items or spells, more or less permanently, I don't know.
Any ideas on that yet?