Cost of a item

[Bahamutkotd]

On a pfs character I purchessed a spiked mithral hvy shield. By my math that should be 1030 correct? Or would I also have to pay for mithral shield spikes? And mithral is always avaiable yeah? And enchanting gear is always avaiable so this shield +1 would be another 1000 gold yeah?

[blackbloodtroll]

You can have Mithral Shield Spikes, or another Special material for your Shield Spikes, on your Mithral Shield.

You would have to pay for them separately.

[Bahamutkotd]

So for the purposes of dr the spikes would be steel? But if I left them off it would be silver? So it says that you have to pay for mw when created. Does this also count for the spikes? So like to make a mithral spiked shield with mithral spikes it would be 1020 + 2510 for the spikes? Or could you make the spikes mw/special after the base shield is created? Also so if the spikes are weapons thus can take weapon enchants how does that intrest with bashing? So a for instance a mithral spiked bashing shield would deal 2d6 + str + 1 yeah? What about after you enchant the spikes to say +1 holy would be 2d6 + 2d6 +2 +str?

[blackbloodtroll]

Bashing does nothing for Spiked shields.

Spiked Shields count as whatever material the Shield Spikes are made of when attacking with them.

[Bahamutkotd]

how can it not? if you enchant a shield with bashing it counts as a +1 weapon and hits for 2 size catagories larger. So a non spiked shield would be 1d8 +1 + str, but saying a spiked shield which is still shield would only attack for a 1d6 + enchants on the spikes i suppose make sense. since it's no longer the shield making the attack... but if you had a bashing shield could you enchant it as a weapon or only the spikes? and would you have to craft the spikes and shield together? or could you make attachable spikes that you could enchant and swap if you wanted to use the normal shield bash/bashing?

[blackbloodtroll]

The Shield Spikes are not being enchanted with the Bashing enchantment, the Shield is, because it is a Shield enchantment.

You can enchant the Shield Spikes as a weapon, with any applicable weapon enchantment.

The Shield Spikes would still need to be Masterwork first.

[Grick]

Bahamutkotd wrote:

how can it not?

Think of it this way:

The spikes are a separate weapon that happens to be mounted on your shield, the same way a gauntlet is a separate weapon that is mounted on your fist.

Something that affects shield bashing doesn't affect the spikes, the same way something that affects your unarmed strike doesn't affect the gauntlet.

The only thing that happens is when you make an attack with shield spikes, it's considered a 'bash' for purposes of losing your shield AC bonus. (or not, if you have the feat)

None of this is really written anywhere, it's just gathered as the intent from posts by James Jacobs. I cited some of his quotes here.

[blackbloodtroll]

If you plan on getting the Bashing property, then avoid Shield Spikes.

[Mapleswitch]

My favorite spiked shield is:
Mithral Quickdraw Heavy Shield +5 of Arrow Catching, Arrow Deflecting, and Animated/with shield spikes +1 enhancement and Defending and Dueling (+2 shield AC/+5 enhancement bonus to shield AC, +1 AC extra from ranged attacks/+5 non-specific bonus to AC, +4 initiative and its animated!)

I personally would never put mithral on the spikes. There is no benefit of that. Silver/cold iron (expensive)/adamantite are the types of special materials for the spikes, but good ole fashion steel is just fine.

[Seriphim84]

I will point out now that James opinion does directly disagree with the RAW.

prd wrote:

Shield Spikes: These spikes turn a shield into a martial piercing weapon and increase the damage dealt by a shield bash as if the shield were designed for a creature one size category larger than you (see “spiked shields” on Table: Weapons). You can't put spikes on a buckler or a tower shield. Otherwise, attacking with a spiked shield is like making a shield bash attack.

At no point is a spike separate from a shield. It is a single item, a Spiked Shield that is used to bash with. If you make your Spiked Shield from mithril the entire item will be made from mithril. If you add an enhancement (like bashing) your Spiked Shield with then it will apply to the whole weapon. The only caveat here is that (except for bashing) improving your shield with magic does not improve your attacks so you must enchant it with a weapon bonus separately.

[Bahamutkotd]

Ok so if say i payed 2030 for a +1 mithral spiked shield it would do 16d + str percing if used as primary, and only affect as steel spikes. but does that mean i could remove/add ablities to the spikes now? say pay another 310 to get MW spikes, or 310 for cold iron or W/E or would i have to buy a whole new shield.

And as much as I respect JJ there has been no offical Errata, and thus RAW say that it stacks, because the spikes modify the BASH attack, And bashing affects the BASH attack. But because they are the same modifier i could see you could bash for a d8, and spike for a d6

[Seriphim84]

No the entire item will be mithril/masterwork. It is only one item.

[Bahamutkotd]

ok so and the RAW say that you can enchant the spiked shield as a weapon. but the bonuses can never be more than +10, so +5, bashing holy defelcting would be fine any only be a 2d6 + 2d6 + 1 + str weapon as far as i can see. And you'd have to pay the weapon price for holy which would be upwards of 8000 gold

[Seriphim84]

well keep in mind that, spikes or no, a shield must be enchanted with shield and weapon enchantments separately.

prd wrote:

Shield enhancement bonuses stack with armor enhancement bonuses. Shield enhancement bonuses do not act as attack or damage bonuses when the shield is used in a shield bash. The bashing special ability, however, does grant a +1 bonus on attack and damage rolls (see the special ability description).

A shield could be built that also acted as a magic weapon, but the cost of the enhancement bonus on attack rolls would need to be added into the cost of the shield and its enhancement bonus to AC.

So the item you described would be a +1 Bashing Deflecting/+1 holy shield with +1 hit/damage and would do 2d6+2d6+1+str Damage. It would cost 34,000gp plus the item itself (16,000 for the Shield Qualities of +4 and 18,000 for the attack qualities +3)

Edit: shields are a weird thing lol

[hogarth]

Mapleswitch wrote:

I personally would never put mithral on the spikes. There is no benefit of that. Silver/cold iron (expensive)/adamantite are the types of special materials for the spikes, but good ole fashion steel is just fine.

In Pathfinder, mithral weapons bypass DR/silver.

[Bahamutkotd]

So the shield would be a +7 item in the terms you just dictated seriphirm?

edit: and a character with shield master would add 2 to dmg and attack rolls or just 1 from the defensive bonus?

[Seriphim84]

No, it would be a +3 weapons and a +4 shield. The caps and costs apply separately.

And, I believe, the shield master feat would do nothing (besides removed the two weapon fighting penalty) because bashing (and the weapon +1) already add a +1 enhancement bonus to hit and armor and enhancement bonuses don't stack. I could be wrong on that though and would happily defer to Grick or BBT on it.

[Bahamutkotd]

thanks much guys appeciate it.

[blackbloodtroll]

In the end, there are ups and downs, to adding Shield Spikes.

For one focused on fighting with shields, the ups to not having Shield Spikes eventually out number the downs.

For you, you will want to avoid them. At most, you will want a +1 weapon enchantment on your shield, so you can add enchantments like Holy.

The rest should be Shield enchantments, so that later, when you have the Shield Master feat, you can add them to attack rolls and damage.