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I had chance to recall the classic Scifi Titan A.E. where the Earth is destroyed by the Drej who are looking for the Genocidal Super weapon known as the Titan. here is Cale. He is presented with two choices - one where he (and other humans will be able to manipulate the drej energy and pilot their ships and maybe evolve to a new level of energy manipulation; the other is use the weapon of mass destruction (the Titan) to commit an act of genocide and Wipe out the Drej and live in the humans-R-Us bigotry that we hoped expired with the Earth.
Here is you: you have just slipped loose of the Drej and can pilot a Drej Space Fighter. Would you want more of that? or do you Destroy the Drej and bring the possibility to a nasty genocidal end?
For me a struggle by Cale to take control of the Drej mother-ship would have been an incredible (and unexpected) outcome.
Rewatched it recently with my girlfriend
The film holds really well and even averts some cliches on the way(guard scene)
Only things I never like when I watch it: the strange Nebula scene and off course the silly ending which makes the Astrobiologist in me die a little every time.
On to your question:
I dont see how he could have managed to do so, given the films sequence
but If It was an Alternity campaign?(many similarities btw) I would definitely see me going a different route..
On the other hand, the destruction of their mother-ship couldn't necessarily mean there isn't any Drej tech left afterwords, their equivalent of tablets,vehicles etc
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Rewatched it recently with my girlfriend
The film holds really well and even averts some cliches on the way(guard scene)
Only things I never like when I watch it: the strange Nebula scene and off course the silly ending which makes the Astrobiologist in me die a little every time.On to your question:
I dont see how he could have managed to do so, given the films sequence
but If It was an Alternity campaign?(many similarities btw) I would definitely see me going a different route..
On the other hand, the destruction of their mother-ship couldn't necessarily mean there isn't any Drej tech left afterwords, their equivalent of tablets,vehicles etc
If they reboot this as a film/series would you like it then?
They definitely missed an opportunity to have Cale fight it out on the Drej mother-ship and come away with control of it. A very different story where Cale fights Korso for control of the Drej energy - Cale looking to use it to evolve humanity and the Korso looking to commit genocide using the energy to power the Titan and return humanity to where it was before the destruction of Earth. The discovery that Cale can pilot a Drej Fighter is the moment of decision. Its a pity they chose bigotry over growth.
You might appreciate THIS ARTICLE about the movie...
I remember watching it but not much more than that. Very forgettable, IMHO...
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Drej who are looking for the Genocidal Super weapon known as the Titan.
I beg your pardon? Even if we go ahead and say Cale's actions at the end were genocide, that doesn't mean the Titan was ever a "genocidal superweapon". It was not only never intended to hurt anyone, the only reason it was ever able to was due to a series of coincidences and a bit of last-minute modification.
"Object that someone was able to modify and jury-rig such that in an extremely specific circumstance it became capable of hurting people as a side-effect of its actual purpose" is not the same as "genocidal super weapon".
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Drej who are looking for the Genocidal Super weapon known as the Titan.I beg your pardon? Even if we go ahead and say Cale's actions at the end were genocide, that doesn't mean the Titan was ever a "genocidal superweapon". It was not only never intended to hurt anyone, the only reason it was ever able to was due to a series of coincidences and a bit of last-minute modification.
"Object that someone was able to modify and jury-rig such that in an extremely specific circumstance it became capable of hurting people as a side-effect of its actual purpose" is not the same as "genocidal super weapon".
The Drej attacked earth because the Titan was a threat to their survival. In the end it was used to absorb their energy and use it as a source of power to create a human home world. What in that isn't a Weapon of Genocide? your unwillingness to call it a weapon of Genocide? or the lack of victims before its use on them?
The Titan is a Weapon of Genocide.
The Titan is a terraforming machine. A Wave Motion Gun is a weapon of genocide.
I can kill people with a power drill but that doesn't make the power drill a Weapon of War.
Rewatched it recently with my girlfriend
The film holds really well and even averts some cliches on the way(guard scene)
Only things I never like when I watch it: the strange Nebula scene and off course the silly ending which makes the Astrobiologist in me die a little every time.On to your question:
I dont see how he could have managed to do so, given the films sequence
but If It was an Alternity campaign?(many similarities btw) I would definitely see me going a different route..
On the other hand, the destruction of their mother-ship couldn't necessarily mean there isn't any Drej tech left afterwords, their equivalent of tablets,vehicles etc
If they reboot this as a film/series would you like it then?
They definitely missed an opportunity to have Cale fight it out on the Drej mother-ship and come away with control of it. A very different story where Cale fights Korso for control of the Drej energy - Cale looking to use it to evolve humanity and the Korso looking to commit genocide using the energy to power the Titan and return humanity to where it was before the destruction of Earth. The discovery that Cale can pilot a Drej Fighter is the moment of decision. Its a pity they chose bigotry over growth.
Well Cale isn't a scientist like his father nor does he live in a time like ours were we can discuss such matters with political correctness and openess of mind.
He was brought up in a time where Humans were hunted down and exterminated, shunned by all, I would say his hatred for the Drej is to be expected, if not even justified.
But any superior tech should be examined so I agree with your premise,even though energy manipulation in that film makes no sense whatsoever(why do they form humanoid shapes if they are pure energy? accomodate themeselves in humanoid buildings and ships etc)
I respectfully disagree with your Genocide argument for reasons similar to previous posters.Its far fetched to present the Drej as the victims.
I would like the idea of a series.But it all depends on presentation and scripting.After Battlestar Galactica there is space(heh) in television for gritty scifi series
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The Drej attacked earth because the Titan was a threat to their survival.
According to what? The movie never said (or implied) any such thing. Where did you even get that idea in the first place?
In the end it was used to absorb their energy and use it as a source of power to create a human home world. What in that isn't a Weapon of Genocide?
It had to be modified in order to do that. It was designed to use its own power cells to create a planet without hurting anyone, then Cale modified it to kill the Drej. That doesn't make the Titan a weapon. If a saboteur makes a nuclear power plant go critical doesn't mean the power plant was a weapon all along. It means someone knew how to take something intended for good and sabotage it.
The Drej attacked earth because the Titan was a threat to their survival.According to what? The movie never said (or implied) any such thing. Where did you even get that idea in the first place?
In the end it was used to absorb their energy and use it as a source of power to create a human home world. What in that isn't a Weapon of Genocide?It had to be modified in order to do that. It was designed to use its own power cells to create a planet without hurting anyone, then Cale modified it to kill the Drej. That doesn't make the Titan a weapon. If a saboteur makes a nuclear power plant go critical doesn't mean the power plant was a weapon all along. It means someone knew how to take something intended for good and sabotage it.
I vaguely remember this as well... That the drej attacked because they were scared. It's been a long time... Will watch again.
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The opening narration said the Titan Project was a testament to mankind's limitless imagination, and that it had the potential to change mankind's role in the universe.
Later, Cale asks Akima (sp?) why the Drej want to kill all humans. He asks what humans ever did to them. The answer he gets is that it wasn't what humans did; the Drej were afraid of what we might become.
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The opening narration said the Titan Project was a testament to mankind's limitless imagination, and that it had the potential to change mankind's role in the universe.
Later, Cale asks Akima (sp?) why the Drej want to kill all humans. He asks what humans ever did to them. The answer he gets is that it wasn't what humans did; the Drej were afraid of what we might become.
The Opening Narration by Cale's Father expresses his personal thought that the Drej were attacking because they were threatened by Human Creativity. He doesn't think of the Titan as a Weapon of Genocide yet it is the Titan they are After when they Blow away Earth. He also says the Titan 'has the capacity to change our role in the Universe' - To one of World Builders?
As the humans on earth are fleeing to the escape ships, someone says: 'they don't know where the titan is or we would have been hit already' So even the scientists know it is the Titan the Drej fear/or want - even if they haven't realized why.
Akima's reasoning as to why the Drej attacked is also a personal opinion. Akima is told of the Titan as a Myth to believe in as a Child 'One day they will find the Titan and it will get better cause we will have a home world again' kind of brainwashing.
In all cases they think Drej destroyed Earth to hold Humans back/down and stop things from being achieved and yet no thought is given as to why the Drej are after the Titan other than that.
The Ship is filled with DNA of all animals and no animals to breed from? No artificial Wombs to grow them in? Its a Hollow thing. Almost like it was built by religious fanatics who decided the creator of the universe will take care of the rest.
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From what I understand the novel of the movie said they attacked because the titan project used the same energy to matter tech that had created their race and could also wipe them out. It wasn't built with that intent but they thought it too dangerous.
Ohhhh So close. As per the novel, the drej were spying via cloaked/camoflage drej on top secret and high research human (implied other species as well) facilities. When Cale's father, physist extraordinaire, made a break through in energy generation/transferance, the spying drej was briefly uncloaked due to energy drain as it instantly (wormhole message?) reported the success of the experiment and access of forbidden sacred knowldge as per Drej religous hierarchal doctrine. A mad construction scramble by the humans to evacuate the earth via colony ships (and one Titan: genesis project and genetic repository ark) before the drej destroyed Earth. We now return you to the present day drama A.E.
Now I want to reread the novel.
Edit: Arrrgh Ninja'd by the Dingo!
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Yellowdingo, you still haven't answered the question of how you got the idea in the first place that the Drej felt their survival was threatened by the Titan.
You established that the motives ascribed to the Drej in the film are the opinions of characters, and therefore not necessarily true. Fine. But at least there's a basis for the idea. Your idea *appears* (barring more citation from the novel) to be purely fabricated by you with no basis on how the story actually goes.
"Things believed by canon characters" > "stuff yellowdingo made up"
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Yellowdingo, you still haven't answered the question of how you got the idea in the first place that the Drej felt their survival was threatened by the Titan.
You established that the motives ascribed to the Drej in the film are the opinions of characters, and therefore not necessarily true. Fine. But at least there's a basis for the idea. Your idea *appears* (barring more citation from the novel) to be purely fabricated by you with no basis on how the story actually goes.
"Things believed by canon characters" > "stuff yellowdingo made up"
On the contrary - 'they don't know where the titan is or we would have been hit already' is the most Drej significant analysis of the what the Drej think.
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On the contrary - 'they don't know where the titan is or we would have been hit already' is the most Drej significant analysis of the what the Drej think.
All that tells us is that they're after the Titan. That doesn't imply anything about WHY they're after the Titan. It even meshes perfectly well with the motivations that you dismissed, as well as any other motive.
Obviously I don't know who you are in real life, but perhaps English isn't your native language? Otherwise I'm not sure how you would come to the conclusion that the line you're citing implies any one motive over any other.
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The Drej technology wasn't all that impressive anyway. Their ships weren't more powerful individually or faster than other races.
Frankly in situation like the ending, you fall back on the sage advice of Captain Reynolds, "Someone ever tries to kill you, you try to kill 'em right back."
The Drej got drained into a battery charge because they attacked someone they should have. That's universal Darwinism at work there friends. "Don't start none, won't be none!"
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Those of us who read the tie-in prequel comics and the novel will know that the Drej were making what we commonly refer to as a "pre-emptive strike."
Their logic went like this:
- The Humans have just discovered Matter/Energy conversion.
- This is sacred knowledge that should only belong to the Drej.
- We should kill them just for that, because only the Drej are advanced enough to use this power responsibly. That other races see us as aloof bullies is inconsequential.
- The Humans SAY they will only use this knowledge to create habitable worlds for the benefit of their race and others... HOWEVER...
- The only way they can do this is with immense power sources.
- Power sources like, say, the Drej.
- We cannot trust the Humans to use this power only as they say they will. If we were them, we would not.
- Therefore, judging them using ourselves as a mirror, we know that the Humans will use their technology to destroy us and in the doing power this new technology.
- Conclusion: We must destroy the Humans before they destroy us.
Cael's father would have destroyed the Titan's technology rather than let it fall into military use. He did not create the Titan as a weapon of war, he created it to save his people and turn dead or not-quite-habitable worlds into places for people to live.
The Titan was not a weapon of genocide until the Drej made it into one. Rather than reach out to Humanity and guide them into responsible uses of the technology, the Drej panicked and decided to wipe out the competition before it could be done to them.
Dingo's incorrect in the basic premise of his argument, but not the conclusion.
(And as to the gene-banks - there were plenty of clone tanks in the Titan for the livestock and whatnot. We just never see them.)
Something makes me feel that gemstone has insider knowledge.
Only in that I read the source material, paid attention to it, and then when the movie came out, paid attention to that. I can provide the Drej chain of logic because it is explicitly spelled out in the source material.
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Well, that certainly changes things.
Not really, because you're still on target with your assertions.
The Titan was never intended to be a "genocidal superweapon."
The Titan was only ever created with the hope and dream of its creator that it be used to create new Earths for the population of Humanity to inhabit, as they were finding themselves faced with a crowded galaxy in which habitable planets were rare and in many cases over-populated, just like the Earth itself.
The Titan was seen as a weapon by the Drej because to the Drej such a thing could only be a weapon - the Drej judged Humanity by using themselves as a measuring stick. The Drej used matter/energy conversion for food, fuel, and ammunition.
It did take a bunch of last-minute modifications to make the Titan capable of doing what the Drej feared it would always be used for - and again, they brought it on themselves by lashing out in jealousy and pre-emptive fear, rather than saying to Humanity "Hey, so, uh, you can do this thing, now... and it's pretty awesome... but don't you want to learn how to do it responsibly?"
Which, when you think about it, is a pretty common theme in Science Fiction.
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Well, that certainly changes things.Not really, because you're still on target with your assertions.
The Titan was never intended to be a "genocidal superweapon."
The Titan was only ever created with the hope and dream of its creator that it be used to create new Earths for the population of Humanity to inhabit, as they were finding themselves faced with a crowded galaxy in which habitable planets were rare and in many cases over-populated, just like the Earth itself.
The Titan was seen as a weapon by the Drej because to the Drej such a thing could only be a weapon - the Drej judged Humanity by using themselves as a measuring stick. The Drej used matter/energy conversion for food, fuel, and ammunition.
It did take a bunch of last-minute modifications to make the Titan capable of doing what the Drej feared it would always be used for - and again, they brought it on themselves by lashing out in jealousy and pre-emptive fear, rather than saying to Humanity "Hey, so, uh, you can do this thing, now... and it's pretty awesome... but don't you want to learn how to do it responsibly?"
Which, when you think about it, is a pretty common theme in Science Fiction.
"...but don't you want to learn how to do it responsibly?"
STANDARD HUMAN RESPONSE TO BEING TOLD OFF BY GOD: V
"...but don't you want to learn how to do it responsibly?"STANDARD HUMAN RESPONSE TO BEING TOLD OFF BY GOD: V
Not sure what you're all-capsing about, there, YD. The Drej were the ones who "knew better" and didn't approach Humanity with the hands of friendship. They quite clearly shot first. The Human response wasn't to "being told off by God" it was to "being smote by God" - which, given the circumstances, makes it pretty understandable, and reasonable.
I thought it was poetic justice, that their pursuit of the Titan facilitated what they were worried about in the first place: their destruction.
They should have checked the human's saying "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions."
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I thought it was poetic justice, that their pursuit of the Titan facilitated what they were worried about in the first place: their destruction.
They should have checked the human's saying "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions."
As I recall, they began hunting humans to remove the threat of the Titan because it was easier than looking for the Titan.
Stating the Drej: Skeletons with Regeneration like Trolls allowing recovery of lost limbs and attached weapon systems.