Mounted combat: ride vs. handle animal

[Patrick Harris @ SD]

One of our locals is playing a zen archer, and likes to flurry from horseback. Recently a GM made him leave the horse outside some ruins, on the grounds that the horse would not be able to function in combat against anything unusual because it only had standard combat training, and it would need the double attack trick to handle "such unnatural creatures as undead and aberrations." In order to get around that, per the GM, you need Handle Animal to make push checks.

The thing is, the rules specifically say that's for "teaching an animal to attack all creatures." The player argues that because he's not using the horse to attack--in fact, he's staying back quite a bit--the horse may be unhappy, but it's not going to panic and run away, because it's combat-trained.

Who is right?

[Grimmy]

I think the player is right.

[Michael Sayre]

I would say the player was actually correct here (with the caveat that GM always gets final say) as far as the rules go. It does seem like that particular trick is only needed if he's actually trying to make the mount attack an unnatural creature.

[Michael Sayre]

I've noticed that a lot of GM's (particularly in PFS) seem to hate mounts and actively look for contrived reasons to prevent them from going everywhere with the party. It's one of the reasons I only play gnome and halfling cavaliers in PFS play, since it's a lot harder to naysay my wolf or riding dog than it is to veto my horse.

[Fabian Stretton]

Ssalarn wrote:

I've noticed that a lot of GM's (particularly in PFS) seem to hate mounts and actively look for contrived reasons to prevent them from going everywhere with the party. It's one of the reasons I only play gnome and halfling cavaliers in PFS play, since it's a lot harder to naysay my wolf or riding dog than it is to veto my horse.

Yes. A couple recently required me to make **THREE** checks just to get my mount to turn around (combat trained mount in combat)

[remorselesslysulkiest]

Ssalarn wrote:

I would say the player was actually correct here (with the caveat that GM always gets final say) as far as the rules go. It does seem like that particular trick is only needed if he's actually trying to make the mount attack an unnatural creature.

DM fiat doesn't exist. A DM can't force a player to play a game he doesn't want to and a player can't force a DM to play a game he doesn't want to.

If a DM really has an unsolvable problem with a mount he should simply say something along the lines of "you shooting really powerfully from far away on a horse is a bit overpowered and I want to nerf that combination a bit so that the game doesn't become too easy for the party."