I'm trying to put the finishing touches on my planned Mammoth Rider for Pathfinder Society, and I wanted to check if anyone had any tips for squeezing any more goodness out of it.
Angel-kin aasimar
Cavalier (Emissary, Order of the Tome) 1
Oracle (Nature mystery) 8
Mammoth Rider X
17 STR
13 DEX
14 CON
12 INT
8 WIS
16 CHA
Traits: Gifted Adept (Divine Favor)
Abendego Spellpiercer (+2 Concentration)
Favored Class: Oracle
Aasimar oracle bonus - +1/2 to effective level for calculating benefits of one revelation (Bonded Mount)
1-Cavalier: Mounted Combat, Power Attack
2-Oracle: Bonded Mount
3-Oracle: Celestial Servant
4-Oracle: Nature's Whispers, +1 STR
5-Oracle: Animal Affinity
6-Oracle:
7-Oracle: Toughness
8-Oracle: Natural Divination, +1 DEX
9-Oracle: Weapon Focus (Greatsword)
10-Mammoth Rider: Gigantic Steed
11-Mammoth Rider: Lightning Reflexes, ???
Mount:
Start as Camel
1: Light Armor Proficiency, Toughness, Link, Share Spells
2: Power Attack
3(4): Evasion, +1 STR
4(5): Weapon Focus (Bite)
5(7): Devotion, Switch to Axe Beak
6(8): Improved Natural Attack (Bite)
7(10): Vital Strike, Multiattack, +1 STR
8(11):
9(13): Iron Will
10(14): Switch to Huge Megaloceros, retrain Weapon Focus and Improved Natural Attack to (Gore), Medium Armor Proficiency, +1 STR
11(15): Improved Evasion
So the idea here is to ride into battle, casting buffs on my mount, my allies, and myself, then attacking like crazy. The +1 CL to Divine Favor from my trait gets me up to CL 9 for +3 to attack and damage rolls. I'm still a bit iffy on my level 11 feat, so any suggestions are welcome.
Yeah, it is banned in PFS.
My opinions:
Would ditching the Cavalier, taking 1 lvl of mammoth rider, and replace those 2 levels with Oracle be better?
You would gain: 1 additional Druid equivalent lvl for your mount(16) and everything that come with that (more hp, a feat, some skills), 2 caster levels, access to lvl 5 spells (say hello to quicken divine favor), another benefit from your curse, you also pick up animal growth as a spell (unsure if the size changes stack - the bonuses will overlap and not stack but the +8 Str is a nice bump compared to the +2 you normally have).
You would loose: 1 BAB, a few HP, +1 fort, Mounted Combat feat, 1 challenge at pitiful strength, lightning reflexes, and colossus hunter. The mount can pick up the light armor proficiency feat in the exchange because it will be lvl 16 instead of 15 and have 1 extra feat.
Also. Wouldn't the big cat be a better choice? You hit the nice damage bump from 1d8 to 2d6 which is slightly better that the 2d6 or 1d4 bumps you get with the megagolceros. 5 attacks on a pounce is pretty nice too. Multi-attack is wasted but I can live with that if I get 5 attacks on a pounce. The only downside is you have to be one of those lame-ohs with a optimized killing machine cat. Albeit, it is a cat the size of a nice cottage.
Oh...can you explain how you picked up the axe beak at lvl 5?
@Lab_Rat:
That's an interesting idea, but remember that the dip in Cavalier also gets me Martial Weapon Proficiency. And I don't think I want to delay getting my huge mount longer than I have to (after all, isn't that the point?), but I did consider just taking 1 level of Mammoth Rider, then going back to Oracle. I think you're pushing me in that direction.
Pounce would be nice, but I think I like the idea of riding a giant elk. It seems more mystical and all. I'll have to look into it.
And I have the boon from GMing the Quest for Perfection series, which gives Axe Beak as an available mount. This character is currently at 3rd level from GM credit.
@cp:
Could you explain how the saurian subdomain cleric works better with this? That would be a major hit to my druid level for the mount. Also, sadly samsarans are not legal for PFS.
@Lab_Rat:
That's an interesting idea, but remember that the dip in Cavalier also gets me Martial Weapon Proficiency.
That's a good point, but in the end it's only a few extra points of damage on your end. I think it's a great trade as your job is more mopping up what the animal companion rips to shreds.
And I don't think I want to delay getting my huge mount longer than I have to (after all, isn't that the point?), but I did consider just taking 1 level of Mammoth Rider, then going back to Oracle. I think you're pushing me in that direction.
How are you delaying it? You would still go into mammoth rider at 10, just like with the cavalier. It's not the BAB or animal companion lvl that delays entry, it's the 9 skill ranks that does. So no matter what you choose your going to get in after 9 lvls of some class. Grabbing on 1 lvl of oracle doesn't get you the great goodies but is probably a decent choice over a 2nd lvl of mammoth rider. I still think that ditching cavalier and the 2nd lvl of mammoth rider is the best choice. That 5 lvl spell slot is oh so nice and opens up the use of quicken spell without the rod.
Pounce would be nice, but I think I like the idea of riding a giant elk. It seems more mystical and all. I'll have to look into it.
Nothing wrong with a theme. My idea was to go all Ulfen and ride a Siberian Tiger to go with the northern winter feel. Mechanically the tiger wins out but it would be pretty awesome to run around on a huge elk. Just remember to dress in shades of red and white, and cary a Bag of Holding type IV.
And I have the boon from GMing the Quest for Perfection series, which gives Axe Beak as an available mount. This character is currently at 3rd level from GM credit.
Lucky you! This is definitely the character to use the boon on.
1) Love the Asimars "Add +1/2 to the oracle's level for the purpose of determining the effects of one revelation."
I hadn't thought of that - brilliant!
2) Mammoth rider offers great power - but Huge can easily become a problem. There are places your mount just can't go...
So either find a way around that or hope you can stay outdoors...
3) Cavalier - a few bonus feats but loses a spell-level. I would want more if I should dip other classes.
I took a fairly involved look at this, some time ago. I think my conclusion was that a cleric with the saurian subdomain made a better choice.
Alternately, you can get into the class via eldritch heritage.
If you go with a cleric, you can choose the samsaran race and choose from druid spell good ness to buff your animal companion.
If you choose human, use eye for talent to give the mount +2 on a stat - which was useful when I was looking at a Tyrannosaurus as a mount ....
.02.
I'm with Ninja on this. Can you explain what it is that made you decide this? All I see is some good spells to buff you animal companion. However, the Aasimar Oracle animal companion is by far the most powerful choice. The level gap between an Aasimar oracle animal companion and anything else of appropriate level is far beyond what a few spells can bridge.
(Any Race) Cleric 10/MMR 1 vs Aasimar Oracle 10/MMR 1. Oracle nets your animal companion:
Animal companion with a starting Int of 6 instead of 2
Celestial animal companion
+5 HD
+3 BAB
+2 Fort, Ref, and Will
+5 Skill Points
+3 Feats
+4 Natural AC
+2 Str/Dex
+2 Tricks
Ability score increase
Improved Evasion
Hmmm....looking at this, I bet the Aasimar Oracle MMR could give the Barbarian MMR a run for their money, especially when you share spell divine favor your super tiger. But that's a different thread.
Mammoth rider offers great power - but Huge can easily become a problem. There are places your mount just can't go...
So either find a way around that or hope you can stay outdoors...
Yep. That's the downside but you can choose somewhat appropriate scenarios based on the advertising blurb on paizo.com. You could also get away with a wand of reduce animal if the going gets tough and the tough need to be size large and squeeze.
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I took a fairly involved look at this, some time ago. I think my conclusion was that a cleric with the saurian subdomain made a better choice.
Alternately, you can get into the class via eldritch heritage.
If you go with a cleric, you can choose the samsaran race and choose from druid spell good ness to buff your animal companion.
If you choose human, use eye for talent to give the mount +2 on a stat - which was useful when I was looking at a Tyrannosaurus as a mount ....
.02.
I'm with Ninja on this. Can you explain what it is that made you decide this? All I see is some good spells to buff you animal companion. However, the Aasimar Oracle animal companion is by far the most powerful choice. The level gap between an Aasimar oracle animal companion and anything else of appropriate level is far beyond what a few spells can bridge.
(Any Race) Cleric 10/MMR 1 vs Aasimar Oracle 10/MMR 1. Oracle nets your animal companion:
Animal companion with a starting Int of 6 instead of 2
Celestial animal companion
+5 HD
+3 BAB
+2 Fort, Ref, and Will
+5 Skill Points
+3 Feats
+4 Natural AC
+2 Str/Dex
+2 Tricks
Ability score increase
Improved EvasionHmmm....looking at this, I bet the Aasimar Oracle MMR could give the Barbarian MMR a run for their money, especially when you share spell divine favor your super tiger. But that's a different thread.
Yep. That's the downside but you can choose somewhat appropriate scenarios based on the advertising blurb on paizo.com. You could also get away with a wand of reduce animal if the going gets tough and the tough need to be size large and squeeze.
Mammoth rider offers great power - but Huge can easily become a problem. There are places your mount just can't go...
So either find a way around that or hope you can stay outdoors...
Actually, you wouldn't need a wand of reduce animal... since your animal companion is coming from Oracle levels, you can cast Oracle spells that wouldn't normally affect creatures of its type on it, so Reduce Person would work just fine.
You could go with elf instead of aasimar - same +1 to a revalation favored class bonus, and then take lorekeeper achetype - looses barkskin, and can't take Celestial Servant, or get a fly speed at level 10, but let's face it there are some great spells on the wizard spell-list...
Overland flight, mirror image, blur, greater inv, beast shape (for your mount)to name a few...
samsarans - don't get the +1 to revalation bonus. Which is the beuti of the build...
Hmm. The elf archetype is interesting, but the DEX and INT bonuses aren't doing much for me. I'd like to still be a good contributer to DPR even while separated from the mount, which is why I'm sticking with the 1 level of Cavalier. Although since I would have to drop the Celestial Servant feat, that would leave me room to do Weapon Finesse and Power Attack with an Elven Curved Blade. Something to think about, I suppose...
well the nature mystery really don't offer much in tfhe combat department. I would let the mount do the damage and go after keeping it alive with ride checks, buffs, and then contribute to the party with spells - which would let you focus on CHA and con. I know the -2 Con hurts - but again - wizard spells...
The nature mystery doesn't help much (although the Nature's Whispers revelation certainly does), but all I need for decent DPR is Power Attack with a greatsword. If I switch to Elf, especially with no cavalier dip, that potential goes down a fair bit. And I think the cleric spell list has enough and good enough buffs to do the job (Divine Favor, Bull's Strength, and especially Blessing of Fervor).
Well if you stick with Aasimar - there's always the Purifier Achetype.
You'll want:
Bonded Mount (Su), Friend to the Animals (Ex) and Nature’s Whispers, from the nature mystery. as soon as possible so extra relavation would be needed - the Achetype is situational better than nature (if you fight outsiders) - if not then it not worth it.
Power attack is a start yes. But if you want to be a warrior oracle it does stop there. you'll need more combat feats, mounted combat - ride by attack, spirited charge and do on to keep damage reasonable. Which will limit your other options.
But if that's what you want - go for it.
Oh, I hadn't noticed the saving throw bonus for my mount on Friend to the Animals. That might be worth considering over Natural Divination, although since the Celestial template will give my mount some SR anyway, I'm not sure how necessary it will be.
And I had originally planned on going for Spirited Charge, but using a huge mount will be difficult enough already; I don't think I can plan on being able to charge. That's just too much investment for such a situational benefit. Are there any other feats you'd recommend?
Well:
Mounted Combat (ride 1) 1/round immediate make ride check to neg attack to mount
Trick riding (ride 9, mounted combat) Don’t take ride checks dc 15 or lower, use mounted combat twice/round
- normally it's a immidiate action - you only get 1 of them/turn so this feat depends on your GM
Mounted Skirmisher (ride 14, mounted combat, trick riding – if mount move it’s speed or less – you can take full round action
- late - but a must if you plan to do melee dam.
And if you hadn't friends to animals:
Indomitable Mount (1 round make ride checks as immediate action instead of mounts Save)
(pre req mounted combat, handle animal 5, Ride 5 lastwall affinity)
- Now you are gonna get better ride checks than saves. But you should be using your immidiate actions for mounted combat. But here it is...
As you can see I would focus on keeping the mount alive - and just be the passive rider that makes things possible...
Heavy armor prof. - +3 AC will help keep YOU alive, so you can keep the mount alive. (or the cavalier get that for free?)
Skill Focus (ride) you really need to be good at this.
While i agree with you...it can be done. Take a trait for UMD and use a wand of reduce person like there's no tomorrow. If need be dismiss the effect for combats in a room large enough. Besides the Huge mount will only be for the last few scenarios (Get it at lvl 10 = 6 scenarios) so you can probably pick out some outside adventures to play.