Whip with shocking enchantment, causes damage on trip attacks?

[Ironballs]

as the question - if a character with a shocking whip attempt to trip an opponent - and succeed :
does the opponent receive the shock damage as a byproduct of the trip (as it does touch the opponent)?
or not at all?

would it matter if the opponent is equipped with metal armor?

[Edgar Lamoureux]

I don't believe so. The term hit usually means an attack roll, and a CMB check isn't technically an attack roll, and therefore can't "hit". It can succeed, but without a hit, the shock enchantment doesn't apply any damage.

However, in a house-rule friendly environment, I don't see any reason not to let it apply, although, of course, I haven't looked at all cases.

[Rubia]

Edgar Lamoureux wrote:

I don't believe so. The term hit usually means an attack roll, and a CMB check isn't technically an attack roll, and therefore can't "hit". It can succeed, but without a hit, the shock enchantment doesn't apply any damage.

Actually, a "CMB check" uses an attack roll, as quoted below:

When you attempt to perform a combat maneuver, make an attack roll and add your CMB in place of your normal attack bonus. Add any bonuses you currently have on attack rolls due to spells, feats, and other effects.

Rubia

[Icyshadow]

The thread title made me giggle.

Also, by RAW the trip does not trigger the damage.

[Ironballs]

well, it's shockingly shocking! :-)

[Chemlak]

The key is that the energy weapon special properties deal "extra" damage, and thus require the weapon to do damage in the first place for the energy effect to trigger. There is a special case for damage reduction reducing weapon damage to zero.

Since trip doesn't do any damage from the weapon, any "extra" damage dice are not rolled (otherwise Sneak Attack would also do damage on combat maneuvers).

However, it's not an unreasonable house rule for energy weapon special properties to still affect targets of CMs that are struck (there will be exceptions, like Sunder).

[Edgar Lamoureux]

Rubia wrote:

Edgar Lamoureux wrote:

I don't believe so. The term hit usually means an attack roll, and a CMB check isn't technically an attack roll, and therefore can't "hit". It can succeed, but without a hit, the shock enchantment doesn't apply any damage.

Actually, a "CMB check" uses an attack roll, as quoted below:

When you attempt to perform a combat maneuver, make an attack roll and add your CMB in place of your normal attack bonus. Add any bonuses you currently have on attack rolls due to spells, feats, and other effects.

Rubia

Ah, true. I felt like I was missing something, and now I know. In any case, the trip doesn't trigger damage by RAW.