Zen Archer Bonus Feats

[AndIMustMask]

Not sure if this falls under a rules question, but I'm wondering why Rapid Shot and Many Shot are in the zen archer archetype bonus feat list when you can't use them with a flurry--which is kind of the selling point for the archetype?

Is this an oversight or a trap for new players, or are they still somehow useful for the archetype and I'm misunderstanding all of this?

[Michael Sayre]

If, for some reason, you wanted your Zen Archer to wear armor, and chose to give up your Flurry, Fast Movement, and AC Bonus but wanted to keep the archery abilities, you would have a use for those feats.

[AndIMustMask]

Ssalarn wrote:

If, for some reason, you wanted your Zen Archer to wear armor, and chose to give up your Flurry, Fast Movement, and AC Bonus but wanted to keep the archery abilities, you would have a use for those feats.

It completely slipped my mind that they might want to wear armor (no sense for a monk, but I could see multiclass characters taking advantage of that). Thanks for the timely response.

I'm also sure this has been brought up elsewhere before, but on a semi-related note: in the case of a character using an archetype that replaces a class feature (like the above zen archer replacing the Still Mind feature with Point Blank Master), could they still take feats that require it (in this case, something like Monastic Legacy)?

[Rycaut]

I think at least in PFS play the general rule is that if a class archetype gives up a feature (like Still Mind) you do not get to take feats that depend on that class feature.

The exceptions are cases that specifically note that they are exceptions (some of the newer Prestige Classes for example accomodate various archetypes a bit more smoothly) but yes Zen Archers can't use Monastic Legacy (as my multiclass Zen Archer/Druid caused me to discover as I was researching feats for him)

[Michael Sayre]

From the PRD:
" A character who takes an alternate class feature does not count as having the class feature that was replaced when meeting any requirements or prerequisites."
So if you give up Still Mind, it's like you never had it at all, and you can't qualify for anything requiring it. Sorry :(

[AndIMustMask]

Oh, well that's unfortunate. Again, thanks for the quick responses.

[StreamOfTheSky]

It's there to serve as a trap for new players and for someone who's dipping Zen Archer only, and thus is better off in the long run w/ rapid shot + manyshot. I still think such a build is stupid, just tossing away flurry of blows like that, but...oh well.

[Krodjin]

Here's a hint: max wisdom above all else. Sure it will hurt for a few level but it pays rewards later in the game.

[Tilquinith]

My guess would be to use them to qualify for some other feats later on like Snap Shot and Improved Snap Shot which require Rapid Shot as a Prerequisite off the top of my head.