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I'm build a synthesist and I'm having a bit of difficulty understanding exactly what my stats will be. I bough Hero lab to fix this but it's not yet implemented, lol.Anyhow, if the Eidolon is of the quadruped type, and he has a speed of 40 feet, do I get that speed when I merge with him? Or do I keep my base 30?
Also, I wanted to ask about my saving throws. If my Summoner has 14 CON and his Eidolon has 13 CON, then they have a +2 and +1 bonus respectively. The Summoner has a base fort (at level 1) of 0 and the Eidolon has a base of 2, what is my fort save when they are merged?
Think of it like this
Anything that is STR DEX CON related e.g. physical speed, natural attacks, fort save, ref save, BAB all of that it determined by the Eidolon because its your physical shell.
Anything Mental INT WIS CHA is determined by your summoner stats.
The fused eidolon doesn't mention anything about using the eidolon's saving throws, so your fortitude save while merged is
0 (fort save from summoner) + 1 (con bonus from eidolon) = 1
This is true saves are not specifically called out so RAW the above is correct.
However considering that the Eidolons form replaces all your physical abilities doesn't really make a whole lot of sense that it replaces your CON and DEX score but not the associated saves Fort and Ref which are a representation of the forms ability to endure or evade. But hey that's just me
The fused eidolon doesn't mention anything about using the eidolon's saving throws, so your fortitude save while merged is
0 (fort save from summoner) + 1 (con bonus from eidolon) = 1
This is true saves are not specifically called out so RAW the above is correct.
However considering that the Eidolons form replaces all your physical abilities doesn't really make a whole lot of sense that it replaces your CON and DEX score but not the associated saves Fort and Ref which are a representation of the forms ability to endure or evade. But hey that's just me
you do get the bonus from the high con or dex added to YOUR saves---just not the base saves from the eidelon.
you do get the bonus from the high con or dex added to YOUR saves---just not the base saves from the eidelon.The fused eidolon doesn't mention anything about using the eidolon's saving throws, so your fortitude save while merged is
0 (fort save from summoner) + 1 (con bonus from eidolon) = 1
This is true saves are not specifically called out so RAW the above is correct.
However considering that the Eidolons form replaces all your physical abilities doesn't really make a whole lot of sense that it replaces your CON and DEX score but not the associated saves Fort and Ref which are a representation of the forms ability to endure or evade. But hey that's just me
True but the base forms provide different saves because of the type of form. For example the Quadruped form has a better Reflex than a Biped for obvious reasons. Personally I don't think that this should be ignored in the synthesists case. But like I said that's just me
Thanks a bunch for all of your help guys. :)
I've been contemplating the saves issue and I think that it might be this way for balance reasons. After all, you can't have great defenses, attack and still be able to cast spells.
Isn't that what Monks have ;)
Isn't that what Monks have ;)Thanks a bunch for all of your help guys. :)
I've been contemplating the saves issue and I think that it might be this way for balance reasons. After all, you can't have great defenses, attack and still be able to cast spells.
Someone talking well about monks instead of bashing them? I think I may shed a tear.
It's definitely a balance thing, cause if you notice their Shielded Meld(and greater) is guarenteed as long as the fusion lasts, so if they had 2 great saves and then atop of it got a constant bonus to saves and AC... Well that would be powerful, arguably too much so.
That said I share sympathy with your plight op, I've been trying to make a synthesist vampire and I'm not sure just how a lot of it works.
Does it's Natural Armor stack with the synthesist's, it says it "gains the eidolon’s armor and natural armor bonuses". I've assumed it simply takes the higher, as would any character with 2 AC modifiers that don't stack, but that doesn't sound right either.
"The synthesist also gains access to the eidolon’s special abilities and the eidolon’s evolutions." What if I purchased a Ability Increase (Ex) for charisma? Do those transfer to the Synthesist since, he gains them? That doesn't quite make sense since he's supposed to use the eidolon's physical scores but not the mental.
And lastly, assuming you get to 16, when you split forms does that mean that the eidolon shares your feats and skill or does it have it's own? And if it is, "treated as a "normal eidolon of the summoner’s class level" then shouldn't we pick those for the eidolon's progression since those should be fixed? Or do we get to decide what it has when split?
All in all I love the flavor of the Synthesist; but it needs a great deal of clarification imo. Of course I'm new here so maybe I'm just missing something.
Isnt the synthesist simply overpowered, because there is no reason not to take Str, Dex, Con at 7,7,7?
There's always a chance your Eidolon could be dismissed, banished or otherwise removed. If that happens, a 7/7/7 physical stats Synthesist is going to be in a tight spot.
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Con 7 in particular would be fatal - if your Eidolon was dismissed due to your Summoner being knocked unconscious (due to hp damage), the 3hp/level loss of hp (due to changing from the Eidolon's Con 13 to Con 7) would essentially mean instant death, from level 2...
Having said that, you can certainly dump Str and Dex :-)
Con 7 in particular would be fatal - if your Eidolon was dismissed due to your Summoner being knocked unconscious (due to hp damage), the 3hp/level loss of hp (due to changing from the Eidolon's Con 13 to Con 7) would essentially mean instant death, from level 2...
Having said that, you can certainly dump Str and Dex :-)
Although your Reflex saves, AC, and Initiative are all going to take a nose-dive from Dex 7. Plus, if the rest of your build is set up for melee combat then strength 7 kills any chance you'll be even marginally useful if your Eidolon gets unsummoned.
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Although your Reflex saves, AC, and Initiative are all going to take a nose-dive from Dex 7. Plus, if the rest of your build is set up for melee combat then strength 7 kills any chance you'll be even marginally useful if your Eidolon gets unsummoned.Con 7 in particular would be fatal - if your Eidolon was dismissed due to your Summoner being knocked unconscious (due to hp damage), the 3hp/level loss of hp (due to changing from the Eidolon's Con 13 to Con 7) would essentially mean instant death, from level 2...
Having said that, you can certainly dump Str and Dex :-)
Reflex saves, AC, and Initiative will all be modified by your Eidolon's Dexterity modifier, whilst you are wearing your 'suit'.
If you are knocked unconscious, and then revived, you can always rely on summoned monsters - Synthesists don't lose that spell-like ability :-)
Alternately, there is always the spell Summon Eidolon, if you need your eidolon in a hurry...
Also, if you are a half-elf, you can take the favored class bonus from the ARG, so that by level 9, you have reduced the time it takes to summon your eidolon normally to 1 round :-)
But eidolon gets only unsommoned after synthesist takes eidolon+own hp -1 in damage.
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Eidolon cannot get banished if summoned through class skill, he has to be reduced to 0 HP.
Think you need to re-read the entry for the Summoner and Synthesist. Both of them very specifically state that Banishment, Dismissal, and similar spells do still work against the Eidolon. That puts the Synthesist one failed will save away from losing it's suit.
Reflex saves, AC, and Initiative will all be modified by your Eidolon's Dexterity modifier, whilst you are wearing your 'suit'.
If you are knocked unconscious, and then revived, you can always rely on summoned monsters - Synthesists don't lose that spell-like ability :-)
Alternately, there is always the spell Summon Eidolon, if you need your eidolon in a hurry...
Also, if you are a half-elf, you can take the favored class bonus from the ARG, so that by level 9, you have reduced the time it takes to summon your eidolon normally to 1 round :-)
True, but we were discussing what happens when the suit is lost. A synthesist who loses their suit is already priority target to any competent enemy with enough brains to understand basic tactics and threat assessment; being extra-slow and extra-squishy won't help in the slightest.
As for the rest, the Synthesist does have options if the suit gets lost, but all those options work a lot better when you're not stuck with a -2 mod for Constitution and Dexterity.