Use of the Appraise Skill

[KingofB]

Hey, chatting with my GM.

We found a set of masterwork silver and bejeweled tools. It was a DC 25 Perception Check to notice the insignia of a local trader on them.

He did not tell us there was an insignia, or to make a perception check, so I made an appraise check. (28) So, when he later revealed there was an insignia of a famous craftsman on it that I didn't know about, I was a little ticked off. He said that appraise only says it determines the value. Every one of the players agreed it had always been used to determine things like guild insignias, craftsmen logos, the crests of houses on items, etc, because such things are intrinsic to the value of the item.

But, when we checked, we saw it was true. A lot of what appraise used to do was gutted from Pathfinder.

So, need a ruling. Can Appraise be used to find and identify the markings of certain people? I say so. Appraising examines an object in FAR more detail than any perception check ever would.

[Ciaran Barnes]

You could say an insignia would fall under one or more knowledge skills, but for crafted goods I would let appraise handle.

[blackbloodtroll]

No, am very sorry you were mislead.
Perception is what you use when examining anything. You accompany appraise to know it's value, and knowledge(history) to know it's history.

[Ciaran Barnes]

Unless the insignia is too small to see normally, or hidden, that's an unnecessary number of rolls. A person knowledgeable in valuables would know the names of famous craftsmen.

[KingofB]

blackbloodtroll wrote:

No, am very sorry you were mislead.

Perception is what you use when examining anything. You accompany appraise to know it's value, and knowledge(history) to know it's history.

But that in itself doesn't make sense.

Knowledge History would be knowing what happened in Gettysburg.

Perception would be me noticing the tag that said it was the coat of a man, who, using Knowledge History, I knew to be a famous officer.

How can I POSSIBLY make an accurate appraise roll if I don't know that? If I appraise it, and find out it's worth a small fortune, but failed the perception check to see the insignia, am I supposed to say, "It's worth 560gp, instead of the normal 180gp one of these would normally be worth. I don't know why."

[Alex the Rogue]

That is a great question and there will be different answers because nothing is writtenin stone when it comes to skill checks. Does your character have a profession such as jeweler or something similar.

If you about exotic items that are worth $$$ would your character know every single craftman for every single time period and every single item you pick up? That is a tough call but I would allow you to estimate the value of the item i.e. if its made from a precious metal etc. Also, if the craftman was local, a family friend or member, or was someone everyone knew then it could be an easier call.

Let us know what eventually was ruled if the GM changed his mind.