Monk flurry as prerequisite for Improved Two Weapon Fighting


Rules Questions

The Exchange

2 people marked this as FAQ candidate.

Ok, the powers that be ruled a while back that the Monk's Flurry of blows ability works exactly like two weapon fighting when weapons are used. So, can a multiclass Monk with a total BAB of +6 and using monk weapons qualify for the Improved Two Weapon Fighting feat?

Grand Lodge

No, he does not actually have the feats, he has Flurry of Blows, which is only like TWF, not actually TWF.

Liberty's Edge

But, it is EXACTLY like two weapon fighting. For now. Got all that?

:-p

Grand Lodge

Remember, that was a "yeah, it works like that" then a "wait, that causes problems, we will get back to you" ruling.


The rules are specific. Either you have the prereq or you don't. Unless there is verbage saying "this counts as X for the purpose of qualifying for feats" then it can not do so.


Flurry of blows already essentially grants the benefits of Imp.TWF and Greater TWF (ie: extra attacks at -5 and -10) at levels 8 and 15, respectively. At least when comparing the FoB attack sequence to what a TWF-fighter would have at the appropriate levels.

See 20th level, for instance: 2 attacks at level-2, 2 at level-7, 2 at level-12, and 1 at level-17.

As such, it wouldn't really make sense if you could take those two feats on top of flurry.


The feats would not give you anything since they do the same thing. That is why a lot of us want FoB to grant the TWF feats as bonus feats. It would solve a lot of problems.


@Are: check the OP: he's talking about a MULTICLASS monk.
if you're fully progressing thru monk, yes, you don't need 2WF feats,
the only thing they would do would let you 2wf with non-monk weapons
(but lagging behind flurry since your official BAB is 3/4 while flurry uses full BAB)

@OP: per RAW, no. it works like 2wf, but you don't have the feats.
personally (houseruling), i would fully allow it to qualify as having 2wf/Imp2wf/Grt2wf,
so that you can take (and use while flurrying) feats like 2 weapon defense.
any such 2wf feats can be taken as if your BAB counts your monk levels as full BAB.
any such '2wf pre-req' feats you take wouldn't be usable if you don't meet the pre-reqs for monk flurrying (i.e. uas/monk weapons, etc). the double slice feat would be superfluous for monks, since their off-hand already deals 1x STR (although an interesting house-rule would be to say that monks that take double slice INSTEAD allow their main-hand to benefit from 2handed DMG bonus if they wield a 2 handed weapon for the main-hand).

Grand Lodge

Remember, the ruling was retracted due to issues.

Grand Lodge

Can I get a link to that retraction?

Grand Lodge

I will search it out. As I recall, the Zen archer was a factor.

Grand Lodge

Here it is:
Attacking with a weapon (or single body part) multiple times with a flurry of blows.

The Exchange

Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

That's not a retraction, that's an acknowledgement of the problem and asking us to wait for a FAQ.

Grand Lodge

So what do we do in the meanwhile? Continue as if it had never been brought up (which is no different from a retraction) or go with the new ruling, knowing the Zen Archer doesn't work with it?


Unfortunately, we wait. That is all we can do. Well, and grouse. But we would grouse anyway, right?

Master Arminas

The Exchange

Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Storm the keep!!

Shadow Lodge

Keep the storm!


Yar!

...and let's not forget the poor Sohei - who can flurry with any weapon he has weapon training in (including two-handed reach weapons) - who has the unfortunate visual (and mechanical mess) of being on a horse, flurrying with his long-spear vs foes 10' away, and half of his flurry attacks need to be kicks to the air beside him. :/

~P

EDIT: sorry, that was all somewhat off topic. As to the OP, by the Rules (regardless of the "clarification") the Flurry of Blows ability does not count as TWF for acting as pre-reqs for other feats.

Though really we just have to wait for the final, official FAQ/Eratta/Blog/Clarification/whatever from the Devs before we will know 100% for sure what is going on.

Grand Lodge

Until the mentioned FAQ, I suggest ignoring the two-weapon fighting flurry thing. If you choose not to ignore, well, then you are riding a three legged horse on unhappy trails.

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Rules Questions / Monk flurry as prerequisite for Improved Two Weapon Fighting All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.
Recent threads in Rules Questions