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I see in the core book that you can fight defensively as either a standard or full round action. For each you get a -4 penalty to your attack roll and a +2 bonus to AC. (pages 184, 187). The bonuses are the same for the standard action and full round action.
I seem to remember in 3.5 there was another option for defense. I believe it was called full defense, or something like that. This was where you could do nothing in the round except try not to get hit, and it gave you a higher bonus to AC that fighting defensively, but you couldn't take any attacks.
Has this been removed from Pathfinder, or is it in the book somewhere, and I just can't find it?
Also, when fighting defensively, do you have to be armed? If I have a shield and no weapon, can I fight defensively (and make no attacks)? If I'm completely unarmed, can I fight defensively?
Thanks!
Fighting defensively works pretty much the same when doing it as a standard action or a full-round action, When you do it as a full-round action however you may make a full attack while doing it (with the -4 penalty), while as a standard action you only make a standard attack.
What you are looking for is called Total Defense. Which is in itself a standard action that grants you a +4 dodge bonus to AC but doesn't let you make any attacks as part of the action. Also you can't make any attacks of opportunity. If you're looking for it in the CRB: Page 186, left column.
also here
Fighting defensively only works when you make an attack.
So being unarmed poses the thread of provoking an AoO.
The AC bonus for fighting defensively and for total defence increases if you have 3 or more ranks in acrobatics.
In addition there are weapons with the blocking specialty, that give a shield bonus when used to fight defensively. But it doesn't state if you need to be attacking with that blocking weapon or if it applies even if you attack with another weapon.
Fighting defensively only works when you make an attack.
So being unarmed poses the thread of provoking an AoO.
Attacking unarmed only provokes from the target of the attack. If you need to fight defensively as a standard action (and can't use Total Defense for some reason), you could still make an attack into an empty square. The square won't hit back.
In addition there are weapons with the blocking specialty, that give a shield bonus when used to fight defensively. But it doesn't state if you need to be attacking with that blocking weapon or if it applies even if you attack with another weapon.
You must attack with a Defending weapon in order to get the bonus. Clarified in this FAQ.
In addition there are weapons with the blocking specialty, that give a shield bonus when used to fight defensively. But it doesn't state if you need to be attacking with that blocking weapon or if it applies even if you attack with another weapon.You must attack with a Defending weapon in order to get the bonus. Clarified in this FAQ.
But a blocking weapon isn't a defending weapon:
Blocking: When you use this weapon to fight defensively, you gain a +1 shield bonus to AC. Source: Ultimate Combat.
However it still has to be attacked with since it says 'fight defensively' and nothing about total defense.
Blocking: When you use this weapon to fight defensively, you gain a +1 shield bonus to AC. Source: Ultimate Combat.However it still has to be attacked with since it says 'fight defensively' and nothing about total defense.
That I do have to make an attack is clear.
But do I have to make it with the blocking weapon?For example: A monk wields a tonfa (blocking) in his main hand and defensively attacks someone with an unarmed strike.
Will he get the shield bonus or not?
As was already stated by Abraham I didn't talk about the defending enchantment but about the blocking weapon quality.
For example: A monk wields a tonfa (blocking) in his main hand and defensively attacks someone with an unarmed strike.
Will he get the shield bonus or not?
In that case it doesn't seem like he's using the weapon to fight defensively.
It's not explicit, though, especially since the ability doesn't list a duration. As written, it would probably only apply during the action in which you're fighting with it. (Which sucks)
A house rule to make it better would be something like:
Blocking: When you make an attack with this weapon while fighting defensively, you gain a +1 shield bonus to AC until the start of your next turn.
<-- loves fighting defensively
level 6 acrobatic fighter doing shield of swings defensively under combat expertise.
+12 AC, -6 to hit, deals 1/2 damage.
can still threaten, can still deal crits (at half damage but crit benefits from crit deck or crit focus still apply)
if you have the spare feats and can stand having to keep one hand free, the crane style line will reduce the fighting defensive penalties to -1 from -4. The first feat reduces it by 2 and increases the AC by 1 and the last reduces it by another 1 and allows you to get an AoO on the attack you deflect. You also gain the ability to deflect one attack per round, which requires one hand free.
If you're a MoMS monk, you can throw in the snapping turtle chain to gain another 2 deflection AC and the ability to gain a free grapple check when someone attacks you, as well as giving them a -4 to confirm crits.
An aldori Swordmaster with crane style can at some point fight defensively without penalty to hit.
An aldori Swordmaster with crane style can at some point fight defensively without penalty to hit.
very interesting, may have to try this as my next melee type...not only will it reduce the penalty to 0, it increases the AC for fighting defensively to 6, which is a nice increase in and of itself.
2 Base
1 for 3 ranks in acrobatics
1 from crane style
2 from the aldori swordlord ability
Total 6
Throw in a 2 levels of MoMS monk to be able to use 2 styles at once and take the snapping turtle chain for an additional 2 shield AC. Then put the guided property on the sword to apply wis to atk/dmg instead of str, this way you can pump wis for AC from the monk.
Figuring you could have at least a 22 wis by 9th, this would give you an additional 6 AC , then using a monks robe to get to at least the +1 range would make it 7
This right there gives 13, on top of any rings, amulets, or bracers you could get to enhance this, you also get evasion from the monk and only lose 1 BAB for the 2 lvl dip.
Could also keep going monk until 4th (an additional 1AC, Ki Pool to enhance dodge ac by 4 each round, slow fall, 10 to movement) and still only be down 1BAB. This would make it potentially +18AC at lvl 11.
Add in 2 from ANA, 2 from ring of protection, and 3 from bracers of armor, 2 from headband of wisdom +4 (totals 41000GP leaves 41000 for other items if going by WBL for lvl 11) for an additional 9AC, then an 18 dex as well for another 4
this gives the potential ACs below
Normal:
41 with ki boost, fighting defensive
37 just fighting defensive
31 without ki or fighting defensive
Flat-footed:
37 with ki boost and fighting defensive
33 just fighting defensive
27 without ki or fighting defensive
Touch (no ANA or bracers):
36 with ki boost and fighting defensive
32 just fighting defensive
26 without ki or fighting defensive
Still have a base 19 to hit and 9 to damage(8 from wis, 10 from bab, at least 1 from weapon as it is needed to put guided on it) then whatever additional feats or wep enhancements you've taken
Is the AC bonus from aldori swordmaster not a shield bonus, too?
If so it doesn't stack with the snapping turtle style.
Is the AC bonus from aldori swordmaster not a shield bonus, too?
If so it doesn't stack with the snapping turtle style.
Nope, the level 7 ability is a dodge bonus:
Steel Net (Ex)
At 7th level, an Aldori swordlord can throw up a blazing wall of steel to defend himself. When fighting defensively as a full-round action with an Aldori dueling sword, the swordlord’s penalties on all attacks in a round are reduced by 2, and the dodge bonus to AC is increased by 2 for the same round.
This ability replaces Armor Training 2.
I also didn't calculate the first ability that they get into the totals, only because you may not always be full attacking, but if you were you'd get an additional +2 AC as this is an untyped bonus (at least according to d20pfsrd.com)
At 3rd level, when an Aldori swordlord makes a full attack with an Aldori dueling sword, he gains a +1 bonus to AC against melee attacks until the beginning of his next turn. This bonus increases by +1 every four levels after 3rd.
This ability replaces Armor Training 1 and 4.
I'm going to assume that what you were thinking of is the feat:
Aldori Dueling Mastery (Combat)
You have mastered the grueling fighting style perfected by the Aldori Swordlords.
Prerequisites: Weapon Proficiency (Aldori dueling sword), Quick Draw, Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus (Aldori dueling sword).
Benefit: You gain a +2 bonus on Initiative checks as long as you start combat with an Aldori dueling sword in your hand. As long as you wield only a single Aldori dueling sword in one hand, you gain a +2 shield bonus to your AC—if you wield the sword in two hands, this bonus drops to a +1 shield bonus to AC. Although the dueling sword inflicts slashing damage, you treat it as if it were also a piercing weapon when determining the effects of weapons used by a duelist.
If you choose to go that route rather than the snapping turtle route, you can switch from a MoMS monk to Sohei, you always get to act in the surprise round, which allows you to activate your ki to ac sooner and start fighting defensively, however you lose fast movement and slow fall, but you can spend a point from your ki pool to enhance your weapon with a +1
Personally I'd go with snapping turtle as you can apply the shield bonus from that to your touch AC, the dueling master feat you can't, although I don't see anything saying you can't take it then choose to use the bonus from snapping turtle and wield the weapon in two hands for damage, then just let go as a free action to get your free hand to activate crane and the other abilities that require one free hand.