Eidolon Unarmed Strike questions

[Mercurial]

My current Eidolon build eventually features two extra pairs of arms (2 evo points each) and claws for all three (3 more evo points). He also has Elemental attacks for additional damage.

My main question is why would I need claws? Could I not simply take Improved Unarmed Strike and have just the arms evolution provide all fo the attacks I need? With most of the damage coming from elemental attacks and strength bonuses, wouldn't simply using fists be adequate and save me those points? Rend would still work as currently worded, correct? Can you get Weapon Focus for Unarmed Strikes as you can for Claws?

Just looking for a reason to spend those evo points on claws if I don't need to...

[blackbloodtroll]

Additional arms does not equal extra unarmed strikes.

[Mercurial]

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Additional arms does not equal extra unarmed strikes.

What?

A character can use hands, feet, elbows, knees and even their heads to perform unarmed attacks, but an Eidolon can't even use all of his hands?

[Tels]

Also, you can take Improved Natural Attack, which will affect the claws but not the unarmed strikes.

[Tels]

Mercurial wrote:

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Additional arms does not equal extra unarmed strikes.

What?

A character can use hands, feet, elbows, knees and even their heads to perform unarmed attacks, but an Eidolon can't even use all of his hands?

True, but by that logic, a person with Improved Unarmed Strike has a full attack of Head, Left Fist, Right Fist, Left Shin, Right Shin, Left Elbow, Right Elbow, Left Knee, Right Knee, Left Foot, Right Foot. But we know that's not how it works. Unless your right fist is separately enchanted then your left fist, all your unarmed strikes are exactly the same. Having multiple hands means you can hold more stuff only. It doesn't give you extra unarmed strikes.

Having multiple limbs and each one having a claw, however, gives multiple natural attacks.

[blackbloodtroll]

The unarmed strike is a single weapon. To assume otherwise will only end with very silly results.

[Archaeik]

I see no major issue with allowing extra arms additional manufactured weapon attacks.

As a baseline, you get a sequence of iterative attacks with 1 weapon.
Provided you have an "offhand" you may also choose to two weapon fight to gain an extra attack. (taking horrendous penalties without the feat)

Per monsters who have 3+ arms, it appears that said arms are able to grant you additional "offhands" for use with Multiweapon Fighting.
(It's not explicit, but I don't know of a monster with 3+ arms who cannot use them for manufactured weapon attacks)

Eidolons are not different. Extra pairs of arms allow additional manufacture weapon attacks.

The sticking point becomes whether you consider uas to be usable as both primary and offhand when TWF...
I consider this combo just fine (and I consider the rules foggy enough that it can be read either way)

So the question isn't about being able to get your extra attacks from multiple offhands, it's about which weapon can they use?
(keeping in mind that you can only make as many attacks as you actually have "offhands" from additional arms)

My 2 cents, I'd allow it. (and monstrous monks would operate on the same assumption)