Our rogue's favored way of fighting is throwing daggers. Other players in the group voiced concern over the fact that he may be ''cheating''. The rogue in question combines two-weapon fighting, improved two-weapon fighting and rapid shot while throwing daggers, effectively being able to throw as much as 5 daggers on a full attack (2 iteratives + 1 rapid shot + 1 TWF + 1 ITWF). Can this be done? Could this be done with pistols or crossbows (assuming you reload as a free action and have an extra hand or two to reload with)?
The game master is a begginer, and often turns to me for advice. In that case, at first glance this combo does seem abusive, especially with sneak attacks on top, but can find anything saying it is illegal. I'd like to know what the RAW is on the matter so our DM and can then make an informed decision.
Hmm.... My initial inclination upon reading this was to say "Oh HECK no!", however...
Pathfinder Core Rulebook (2nd printing, don't know if this has been errata'd), p. 202, under the section on Two Weapon Fighting:
Thrown Weapons: The same rules apply when you throw a weapon from each hand.
Right there in black and white. He's good to go.
I'd say no on the pistols and crossbows, because they're not thrown.
He can do it, but the penalties(from TWF and rapid shot) stack. He also had to take quick draw in order to pull the daggers out as a free action so he can throw them.
He can do it, but the penalties(from TWF and rapid shot) stack. He also had to take quick draw in order to pull the daggers out as a free action so he can throw them.
Yeah, he did. After I told him he had to to throw that many daggers.
Thanks for the answer. This way if our GM decides this is a problem and want to limit this, he'll know it's a houserule.
Ranged rogues suck. If the GM nerfs it the player will just go into melee and sneak attack for more damage. All those thrown daggers will also run in issues with DR since the rogue probably won't have enough money to enchant all of them.
edit: Of course the player might just be throwing the daggers on round one, and then charging in, but that is not a great idea either.
Still works with crossbows and guns just need a free hand or some cheese to keep up the reloading.
That dager trick was sugested at feat combo in 3.0 dragon magazine.
The one that 3.0 came out in. So it work I have see it ton times.
The thing you have to rember is that rouge is -4 on ALL ATTACK that he rapids shot and two-weapon fights.
The rogue could dual wield hand crossbows, but not light crossbows.
Crossbow, Light: "Normally, operating a light crossbow requires two hands. However, you can shoot, but not load, a light crossbow with one hand at a –2 penalty on attack rolls. You can shoot a light crossbow with each hand, but you take a penalty on attack rolls as if attacking with two light weapons. This penalty is cumulative with the penalty for one-handed firing."
This combo is only good if someone has improved invis on the rogue. Otherwise you're hitting 5 times with normal daggers, which really shouldn't be bothering anything.
|
My favorite method of proving a player can do something is to show a NPC within published material that does the same thing. This method is usually only needed for real stickler DMs. Your two weapon throwing rogue is totally legit by the way, hopefully you will get the point across with little trouble.
Bump for rules question.
I'm making a high level Gunslinger that dual-wields revolvers.
I would argue that TWF and Rapid shot would give you 4 attacks with 2 revolvers, not 3. Rapid shot states that "When making a full-attack action with a ranged weapon, you can fire one additional time this round."
So rapid shot would be applied to each gun.