Tower Shield Specialist

[Tarma]

I'm not sure if this is the right section for this post, and if not feel free to move it. I'm also not sure if this is been asked before, and if so I apologize in advance.

At level 5, the Tower Shield Specialist gains the (ex) ability Tower Shield Specialist in which they don't take the -2 penalty when making attacks while using a tower shield. However, just by being a fighter doesn't the class get that ability at level 1? Is there any purpose to this ex ability beyond a waste of a class skill? Or is that a typo that hasn't been fixed yet?

Thanks!

[Maxximilius]

Being proficient with a tower shield doesn't mean you don't get the -2 penalty to attack when wielding one - this Specialist ability removes the penalty.

[Tarma]

The CRB says that tower shield proficiency says that there's no penalties on attack rolls while using a tower shield. It even says that in the quick description of the feat in the book, it's on page 116

[Maxximilius]

You get a penalty on attack rolls equal to the Armor Check Penalty of the shield if you are not proficient with it.
Tower Shields have in addition a -2 penalty written in their description that isn't removed even if you are proficient with them (otherwise you would suffer a total -12 penalty to attack).

[Tarma]

Normally I would agree, but the feat description says no penalties. It's not "no armor check penalties, but the -2 still applies" It says outright no penalties, that -2 should still be included in it.

[Maxximilius]

Yet it isn't as you read it, as the Tower Shield Specialist proves it.

Also :

Tower Shield :
"When employing a tower shield in combat, you take a –2 penalty on attack rolls because of the shield's encumbrance."

Tower Shield Proficiency (Combat) :
"When you use a tower shield, the shield's armor check penalty only applies to Strength and Dexterity-based skills."

[Tarma]

How could I be misreading this? I know that's what the text says, but if you look at the quick description of the feat (which can be found here: http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/feats.html ) it says no penalties on attack rolls. That would include all penalties.

[Maxximilius]

Read it again :

- Without proficiency in shields, you suffer their Armor Check Penalty as a penalty to attack.
- Tower Shield has a -10 Armor Check Penalty. It also has a special quality totally unrelated to Armor Check Penalty that makes the wearer suffer an untyped -2 penalty to attack.
- Tower Shield Proficiency makes so that your shield's Armor Check Penalty doesn't apply anymore to attack rolls. It doesn't say you don't suffer "any penalty to attack rolls", it says you "don't get the Armor Check Penalty to attack" anymore.

The quick description of the feat doesn't matter, it's the full writting of the feat that counts. This writting says that you remove the -10 (Armor Check Penalty) to attack.

You still suffer the -2 to attack, unless you are a Tower Shield Specialist of high enough level.

[Shar Tahl]

That may be an earlier print copy that has things that have been reworded in errata

Direct from PRD:

Shield, Tower: This massive wooden shield is nearly as tall as you are. In most situations, it provides the indicated shield bonus to your AC. As a standard action, however, you can use a tower shield to grant you total cover until the beginning of your next turn. When using a tower shield in this way, you must choose one edge of your space. That edge is treated as a solid wall for attacks targeting you only. You gain total cover for attacks that pass through this edge and no cover for attacks that do not pass through this edge (see Combat). The shield does not, however, provide cover against targeted spells; a spellcaster can cast a spell on you by targeting the shield you are holding. You cannot bash with a tower shield, nor can you use your shield hand for anything else.

When employing a tower shield in combat, you take a –2 penalty on attack rolls because of the shield's encumbrance.

*****************************************

Tower Shield Prof:

Tower Shield Proficiency (Combat)

You are trained in how to properly use a tower shield.

Prerequisite: Shield Proficiency.

Benefit: When you use a tower shield, the shield's armor check penalty only applies to Strength and Dexterity-based skills.

Normal: A character using a shield with which he is not proficient takes the shield's armor check penalty on attack rolls and on all skill checks that involve moving, including Ride.

Special: Fighters automatically have Tower Shield Proficiency as a bonus feat. They need not select it.

[Trikk]

Tarma wrote:

How could I be misreading this? I know that's what the text says, but if you look at the quick description of the feat (which can be found here: http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/feats.html ) it says no penalties on attack rolls. That would include all penalties.

Playing the game by the short descriptions is hilarious when you reach the spells chapter. Expeditious Retreat is amazingly good when it's permanent.