Hey! You got some Bard in my Cleric!

[Mauril]

Working on some cross-class archetypes and I really liked this as an option for a cleric archetype.

Basically, the cleric (probably called Battle Leader or something) loses Channel Energy. In its place he gains some Bardic Performance.

I'd be up for not giving them countersong (mostly useless), distraction (also mostly useless), fascinate (not thematic), suggestion and mass suggestion (requires fascinate and is also not thematic).

That leaves inspire courage, inspire competence, dirge of doom, inspire greatness, soothing performance, frightening tune, inspire heroics, and deadly performance.

That gives them 8 of 13 abilities. It replaces up to 10d6 worth of burst healing. Giving them the same Bardic Performance pool as a Bard, this guy would be pretty formidable. The only thing would be how much is obviates the bard.

Same HD and BAB
Better casting
Better armor
Roughly par on weapons (depending on deity)
Worse skills (important to lots of people)
Slightly diminished BP
Better good save (fort beats ref)

It kind of comes down to this: are 4 skill points, versatile performance, the suggestion abilities, jack-of-all-trades and loremaster (most of those are skill related) worth much better casting and somewhat better armor.

I was considering not dropping the spells per day, but I'm going back to thinking that I really need to for balance. I'd also be okay with dropping deadly performance.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

[Atarlost]

I'd compare you idea to the Paizo published Evangelist, which drops medium armor and shield proficiency, a domain, spontaneous cures, and 3 levels of channeling for countersong, fascinate, inspire courage, inspire greatness, and inspire heroics.

Generally the cleric list seems to be considered not a lot better than 2/3 arcane casting as indicated by giving them 3/4 BAB and full casting. All of the good divine buffs seem to be self only, and some overlap in part with common arcane buffs (eg haste and divine power).

[Cheapy]

What's wrong with the evangelist?

Personally, I do not see all those amazing performances as equal to some burst healing a few times per day. Especially since you can just use a wand of cure light wounds to heal.

[Bardess]

Maybe you would join us on the Multiclass Archetypes thread. You could find what you seek there, or we coult help you brewing it.

[Mauril]

The thing that's wrong with the Evangelist is that I forgot it existed. I got to thinking about building a class like the Marshall and never thought to look past the names on this round of checking before homebrewing.

Thanks.

[Mauril]

After getting a further chance to look at it, the Evangelist still isn't what I want. It pretty much loses the ability to function as a front line battle cleric.

What I really wanted from the bardic list is really Inspire Courage and Inspire Competence. I'd be willing to drop the entirety of Channel Energy for those two. The others were added in because it's easier for me to remove options than come around later and try to figure out what to add.