UMD and the Ring of Revelations


Rules Questions


There were some other posts on this a month or two ago, but I'm making a new thread since I'm taking this on a bit differently than they did in the other threads. I saw a thread in another subforum earlier about how the Ring of Revelations + UMD can give any character access to oracle revelations, and I just wanted to make sure that the way I see the rules on this is accurate.

Ring of Revelations lists several requirements for using the item. As an example, I'll use a Greater Ring of Revelation [Wings of Darkness].

Here are the requirements, listed in the item's description, for using this item:

1. Must have the Dark Tapestry mystery.
2. Must be a 7th level oracle.

If these requirements are met, then the user gains the Wings of Darkness revelation while the ring is worn.

Let's pretend we have three characters:
A. A bard 20 with a +40 on UMD.
B. A Dark Tapestry Oracle 1/Synthesist 9 with a +29 on UMD.
C. A Lore Oracle 7 with a +15 on UMD.

A tries using the item. He rolls UMD to emulate a class feature, and successfully convinces the item to think he has that class feature. Sadly, the item still requires him to be an oracle, and one of 7th level at that, and he cannot emulate that, so he fails to use the item.

B tries using the item. He does meet the Dark Tapestry Mystery class feature requirement, but he does not meet the Oracle 7 requirement. Since this cannot be emulated, he fails to use the item.

C tries using the item. He rolls UMD to emulate the Dark Tapestry Mystery class feature, and gets a 23 on his roll. He has successfully emulated that class feature, and since he is also an oracle 7, the item gives him its effect: access to the Wings of Darkness class feature. Since he is a 7th level oracle, he is able to fly at 60 (good) for up to 7 minutes per day in 1-minute increments. This is not dependent on what his roll on UMD was, since the revelation depends on oracle level and not the effective level of his Dark Tapestry Mystery class feature.

Sadly for him, since he is trying to emulate that class feature constantly, he will have to make a new check every hour to continue having access to the Wings of Darkness revelation. If he fails, he can immediately try again, but if he rolls a 1 he will have to wait 24 hours before trying again. If he had a +20 in UMD or better, he would not have a chance of failing, and even rolling a 1 would be a success.

Does that sound right to everyone?

Relevant rules text:

Ring of Revelation wrote:
The oracle must have the appropriate mystery to use the ring, and must meet the level requirements (if any) of the revelation itself; for example, a ring of revelation (combat healer) is only usable by an oracle of at least 7th level with the battle mystery.
UMD wrote:
Emulate a Class Feature: Sometimes you need to use a class feature to activate a magic item. In this case, your effective level in the emulated class equals your Use Magic Device check result minus 20. This skill does not let you actually use the class feature of another class. It just lets you activate items as if you had that class feature. If the class whose feature you are emulating has an alignment requirement, you must meet it, either honestly or by emulating an appropriate alignment with a separate Use Magic Device check (see above).


I would rule that one of the features of the Oracle class is that it exists, so the DC to be a Oracle 7 is 27.


Fenrisnorth wrote:
I would rule that one of the features of the Oracle class is that it exists, so the DC to be a Oracle 7 is 27.

"Class features" has a meaning in pathfinder, or at least it is a header for every class with things under it, and being a certain class and having a certain level in it are not listed under class features for any class.

Anyway, the item doesn't actually give you the effect of the revelation, but rather gives you the revelation. Since the revelation itself isn't being UMD'd, you'd end up with 0 minutes of flight per day if you had 0 levels in oracle, even under your interpretation which allows the emulation of class and level for the item's purposes.


Omelite wrote:
Fenrisnorth wrote:
I would rule that one of the features of the Oracle class is that it exists, so the DC to be a Oracle 7 is 27.

"Class features" has a meaning in pathfinder, or at least it is a header for every class with things under it, and being a certain class and having a certain level in it are not listed under class features for any class.

Anyway, the item doesn't actually give you the effect of the revelation, but rather gives you the revelation. Since the revelation itself isn't being UMD'd, you'd end up with 0 minutes of flight per day if you had 0 levels in oracle, even under your interpretation which allows the emulation of class and level for the item's purposes.

Read the use of UMD in the skill descriptions: Sometimes you need to use a class feature to activate a magic item. In this case, your effective level in the emulated class equals your Use Magic Device check result minus 20.

This would suggest you can do precisely that.


meatrace wrote:
Omelite wrote:
Fenrisnorth wrote:
I would rule that one of the features of the Oracle class is that it exists, so the DC to be a Oracle 7 is 27.

"Class features" has a meaning in pathfinder, or at least it is a header for every class with things under it, and being a certain class and having a certain level in it are not listed under class features for any class.

Anyway, the item doesn't actually give you the effect of the revelation, but rather gives you the revelation. Since the revelation itself isn't being UMD'd, you'd end up with 0 minutes of flight per day if you had 0 levels in oracle, even under your interpretation which allows the emulation of class and level for the item's purposes.

Read the use of UMD in the skill descriptions: Sometimes you need to use a class feature to activate a magic item. In this case, your effective level in the emulated class equals your Use Magic Device check result minus 20.

This would suggest you can do precisely that.

I read it as if the UMD-20 was your effective level for the purpose of that class feature, e.g. rolling a 27 would let you emulate 3D6 channeling while a 26 would only let you emulate the 2D6 version.I guess it does say "emulated class" right there in the text though, which does seem to indicate that the class itself is also emulatable through that roll, as well as the class level.That whole paragraph is worded pretty terribly, though.

Of course, since the ring just gives you the revelation and not the effects of that revelation, you'll still be level 0 oracle for the purposes of any revelations which care about your oracle level. Still, a lot of the revelations are good regardless of oracle level.

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