No way!!!
I'm sorry. You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but retiring characters just DOESN'T WORK. Comic book history has proven this again and again.
Take, for example, the JSA. (I just HAVE to bring up the JSA, as I've considered them, for the past several years, to be my favorite team, ever since I read the 1999-2006 run.) Roy Thomas tried to retire them in The Last Days of the Justice Society, in 1986, for reasons that made no sense. DC tried to retire them in 1994, in Zero Hour. But they kept coming back. It was inevitable. All it takes is a few fans in the company to bring them back. (Indeed, in an introduction to "Last Days," Roy Thomas flat out said that someone else would one day bring them back, but it was the end of the JSA as far as HE was concerned.)
If a reboot kills off characters, or says that some characters never existed, they will come back.
So if I were in charge of a reboot, I'd say that Earth-2, where the JSA fought during WWII, exists, but the current JSA is still around. On Earth-2. Where the JSA belongs. The idea appealed to so many readers in the past, so why destroy that?
All characters whose existence DC had previously tried to erase, ultimately unsuccessfully, must now exist. If they couldn't be erased before, they won't be erased this time. For example, Supergirl is truly Superman's cousin.
And Superman (of Earth-1, anyway) really used to be Superboy, and he really joined the Legion of Superheroes. That will restore what I consider to be the "real" LSH continuity.
And if there's any universe-changing crisis, it can only change things AS THEY ARE. It can't change the PAST of the new continuity.
(Okay, you may have guessed from my post that my knowledge of DC comics is many years out of date. My views might have been different if I had actually READ recent comics. But this is my "old fogey" point of view. In my day, comics...)
Anyway, if I were the president of DC, I would take the best writers and editors I could find for each title, and tell them "Okay, we're rebooting. Write the history of your characters... but don't take too many liberties! Remember to keep the ideas that worked in the past!"
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I would take advantage of the fact that there are 52 Earths where stuff is going on. From what I know of, the only time we see anything at all from any earth other than Earth 1, is when it somehow has something to do with Earth 1. Doesnt earth 2 have its own stories that dont neccessarily have to be told to Earth 1 people as 'backstory'? Cant we have stuff that is actually happening there?
I think I would leave the current setting in DC as it is, being Earth 1, changing nothing on that Earth. Maybe stop doing comics of that earth for a year, and do a complete reboot (no Darkest night events, no 5 Robins or anything like that) and start from scratch 5 years back like they are trying to do, but do it on Earth 17 or something.
As sales for Earth 17 comics start to fall off and arent as popular, pick up sales for books on Earth 1, so that eventually you have dual continuities going. What doesnt sell in the one goes by the wayside and gets reintroduced in the other.
Obviously, youll have stuff thatll need to be in both, but thats why they have multiple books for the topic (Superman and Action Comics, Batman and Detective Comics, GL and GLC, etc).
Eventually, if Earth 17 becomes increasingly unpopular, the titles stop being produced as much, and it fades into the background, like the rest of the 51 earths that arent Earth 1.
Thank you CJ. I was mulling about creating this thread myself.
If I was in charge of the CURRENT DC proposed reboot, I simply wouldn't do it. I have a Legion that both Eileen and I can agree upon, Batman et. al recognizing other Batmen the world over(I loved the semi-cheesy Batman Manga from the 60's), Superman renouncing his American citizenship yet not going in the "I'm king of my own country!!!" direction of X-Men...Lots of interesting stuff that can still be worked with, altered, or what have you. However, if this is the world of DC comics according to FHDM, then I'd make a lot of changes.
Let's go down the list, world by world; character by character.
Individuals:
Batman- I would have Bruce continue to be Batman until around this point in time in comic book history. No funky Darkseid rays or anything like that, however- he would just want to retire. Maybe he messes up and something tragic occurs(accidentally kills the Joker) or wonderful(marries Selina Kyle/Talia, gives birth to Helena/Damien, who grows up to be the new Huntress/Robin), but he realizes he can't be Batman forever. A much more interesting Battle for the Cowl ensues(sans Jason Todd, who, despite the occasional chuckle he gives me, remains quite dead), and Dick ends up becoming the new Batman after a heart-rending verbal battle with Bruce and Tim(who becomes something other than Red Robin. Not that I dislike the character- quite the opposite, I LOVE Tim- it's just that he's named after a fricken' fast food chain). And yes, Jason Todd is MENTIONED in the argument.
Superman- I actually have no problem with him renouncing his American citizenship- but I want him to see him form a Kryptonian Enclave in his Fortress of Solitude as a result. Maybe he feels he's too powerful to live on Earth, maybe he has a bout with some funky kryptonite that makes him go crazy or something, I dunno. But the book would continue as ever with his usual cast of friends and foes, and his relationship with Lois would actually go somewhere. Pregancy scares, arguments, etc.
Wonder Woman- Have my wife, my friend Mark, and DeathQuaker come up with a new continuity for her. Either that or roll 1d4 and have whichever associated background for her become the canon for her. Aside from that, keep the character going as ever and come up with some original villains for her that are not stereotypes. I would focus more on problems with the Olympians and less on problems with Man's World. And give her a variety of costumes.
Green Lantern- Despite the strong temptation, I would not have Kyle Rayner killed off. I would continue the ongoing storyline as it is now, however, I would not have
The Flash- I would share the book between the assorted speedsters. No weird random deaths or killings or anything like that. Also no funky power spikes or ebbs- the Flash is a very, very powerful character, and I would not change that. It would be less of a team book and more of a family one, and that includes the Rogues. And yeah, I would bring back Captain Boomerang II and potentially keep I dead- so much potential lost there with him and Tim. If this means I have to alter Blackest Night a bit, then so be it.
Aquaman- Less of a focus on him being a fair haired golden child whose ability to speak to fish is useless in most situations, more of a focus on him as a king of a people that most of humanity never hears from. I would lop off the hand and replace it with a trident, and in many ways give the Aquaman from the Justice League cartoon his own comic. Maybe he'd have a few cameos from Warlord and other people who are kings of their own unique and hard to get to worlds. A war between two peoples would be interesting.
Martian Manhunter- Interestingly enough, I would have him remain black and do the whole "stranger in a strange land" thing in his own book, with many, many references to The Brother From Another Planet. Many cameos from Red Tornado and other people who are not exactly human/welcome on earth. Miss Martian would get a lot of time in the comic as well, as it would be shared between the two characters.
Green Arrow- I would follow Bitter Thorn around for about a month until I feel I could get aspects of his political views down, and make Green Arrow a hero for those so liberal they are outside of the "normal" political spectrum. Queen Industries would essentially do everything it could to change the world for the better while occasionally flying in the face of laws. I know Black Canary would make appearance after appearance in the book, but I do not know if it would be a "shared" title. Speedy will lose his arm and become Arsenal when it is replaced with a Cyborg-like bionic limb. This, not his drug use(which will still be mentioned in flashbacks and arguments) will be the schism between the two characters as Arsenal will become a government agent working with Amanda Waller(i.e. "sell out" in Green Arrow's eyes).
Hawkman/Hawkwoman- I would bring back the space cop thing, and probably the futuristic wings as well. I need to figure out why they are on earth and not Thanagar, and see whether or not they should make regular returns to their homeworld or something.
Power Girl- Bring Amanda Conners back to the comic. That's about it. I loves me some Power Girl.
Captain Marvel- Reinstate the Marvel Family, opposing the Black Marvel Family on an Order vs. Chaos scale. Let Billy Baxton grow up.
That's all I can think of for individuals. Let's get to
Teams:
Justice League:
Roster- Essentially everyone. The Justice League would be a proving ground for serious superheroes who are watched over by the big 3, who decide who will be on the team in yearly stints(no more than two consecutive years) and spend time physically leading the team(although they can't be everywhere at once, deputies will be selected/volunteer/seize the reins on occasion). People who serve on the Justice League will be "JL rated" and considered true superheroes by the community and world governments. If not, then they are a sidekick, renegade/rogue, or potential menace.
What's it about?- There will be political storylines(Cuban superheroes, Arabic superheroes trying to get facetime), house-cleaning storylines(someone goes rogue), as well as just general adventuring. If drama occurs in the book, it will be dealt with on a team level- anything else will be dealt with in individual books.
Justice Society:
Roster- Everyone, but especially Green Lantern(Alan), Wildcat, Flash(original) Hawkman, Mr. Terrific, Citizen Steel, Damage(see below), Liberty Belle/Jesse Quick, Hourman, Cyclone, Jakeem Thunder, Obsidian, Jade, Power Girl, Mr. America and other "Legacy" characters
What's it about- Essentially a book for people who can't stop being super heroes for one reason or another. Their big 3(Alan, Ted and original Flash) are going to do this until they die because they can't think of doing anything else, other characters are "legacy" characters who are super heroes because their parents were or they are somehow carrying on the legacy of super heroes that "retired" or met a natural (or unnatural) end. Lots of general super heroics, also a look at why people become super heroes or why they can't stop being them.
Teen Titans:
Roster- Robin, Troia, Wonder Girl, Arsenal, Superboy, Cyborg, Starfire, Raven, Jericho, Changeling
What's it about- This is essentially two teams: one the grown up version of the team of sidekicks that Dick created, the other the new sidekicks that have yet to be vetted by the Justice League. There should be some friction between the two groups as youthful energy meets the voice of experience and reason, as well as some feelings of abandonment as people like Cyborg and Arsenal do stints in the Justice League, leaving the "minor leagues" behind. Also, general superheroics.
Legion of Super Heroes
Roster- Do you have to ask?
What's it about- What do you think? No changes made here. LONG LIVE THE LEGION!!!!
That's all I can think of right now. May add more later.
Freehold_DM: I'm honored to be a contributor to your Wonder Woman continuity.
For me... I'd... probably more or less take the DC Animated Universe with a few minor adjustments (formally form the Birds of Prey with Oracle in charge and all that)... make it a bunch of comics, and put Bruce Timm and Paul Dini in charge of the whole shabang, and sit back and enjoy.
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I would divorce most of the titles from each other. There are 52 (or more) universes out there, and there's no reason for the JSA to *have* to be on the same earth as the JLA, or the grown-up Titans, or the Marvel family. Crossovers can bring them together, or allow popular characters from one corner of the multiverse (such as Black Adam) to become threats to Superman in another corner of the multiverse, etc.
They don't *have* to be redundant or stepping on each others toes. The JLA and JSA had annual teamups for years before Crisis borked everything up (and started being soft-retconned that same year, and has finally, twenty-five years later, been pretty much abandoned).
I wouldn't explicitly 'retire' anyone, but the majority of titles would have six to twelve issue runs, and the creators who want to work with those characters would have to pitch a story arc to warrant that title being printed. There would not *always* be a wandering often-mediocre monthly Wonder Woman or Green Lantern or Flash or Aquaman title, 'just because.' There would have to be an actual storyline already planned out for that.
When that storyline wraps up, if nobody has a sizzling cool idea for the next six or twelve issues of Flash, then there will not be a Flash #7 'fill-in artist' one-shot issue. Flash may appear as a guest-star in other books, or in team books that feature him, but he won't get a solo run again until someone comes up with a reason for him to have a solo run. There will be no scrambling for a new creative team to 'fill the hole' and string a book along on life-support. *When* a new team comes along with a red-hot pitch and fire in their bellies to tell stories about that character or team, *then* there will be a new six to twelve issue run for them.
The serial comic concept, I think, has run it's course.
A few flagship characters (like Batman) might continue with the monthly serial format, but most of the DC characters haven't proven able to support that, and, IMO, would be better served as characters and properties only being written in six to twelve issue story-arcs that have a beginning and an end, and don't meander around without focus for another year getting progressively worse, or being foisted off on writers and / or artists who don't 'get' what made them popular in the first place (see, pretty much every floundering misguided attempt to relaunch the Wolfman/Perez lineup of the Teen Titans since, well, Wolfman/Perez).
Tossing different groups back into the multiverse also, IMO, allows characters like Jay Garrick and Alan Scott to continue being 'the Flash' and 'the Green Lantern,' without tying them into concepts like the Speed Force or whatever.
It also makes room for groups like Infinity, Inc. to show up, or the Teen Titans to grow up without leaving Nightwing, for instance, trapped in between a Batman he will never be allowed to reach (and who, as Dick grows older, increasingly *should* be in his forties...), and a Robin that is now leading Young Justice, or has been replaced himself by Damien, etc. I like that Nightwing has outgrown 'Robin,' but putting him in the same world with Batman and Tim and Damian freaks Didio out, and he's been trying to kill him for a decade now. Just stick him on 'Earth T' with the rest of the adult Titans, and say that time flows a little bit faster there, so that when the inevitable crossover occurs with Batman, someone can comment how odd it is that Nightwing is now almost as old as Bruce. Bang, timeline / aging crap solved. Didio can change his adult diapers and find another excuse to want him dead.
With the success of titles like Exiles, concepts like the Ultimate Universe, etc. I think Marvel has proven that multiverses 'work' just fine.
Indeed, Marvel used their Ultimates universe to soften the blow for the transition for cinema, changing the iconic looks of Captain America, Iron Man, Thor and Nick Fury, before unleashing those characters on the big screen. If Sam Jackson had been portrayed as Nick Fury without the Ultimates version having primed us for that, I'm sure there would have been grumbling. If we hadn't spent years watching a version of Captain America with straps and pouches and combat harness and guns, the movie Captain America, with straps and pouches and combat harness and guns, would likely have drawn the same sort of internet nerdrage that Superman drew for having underwear and an S-shield that were 20% smaller than they look in the comics.
I suspect that the costume changes for the DC reboot are hoped to do the same sort of thing, massage expectations, so that the next time DC makes a movie and the character costume is something a bit more big-screen-friendly than painted-on-tights, the comic-book-reading-audience will have had a little time to get used to the iconic heroes wearing something a bit more cinematic and a bit less 'naked dude painted blue and red.'
I'd also make an editorial mandate that killing characters will only occur when it's relevant to one of these story-arcs. Nobody would be expendable. No villain that nobody cares about would be 'fluffed up' by having them kill a half dozen Teen Titans.
Sure, there are fans that *love* that sort of thing, and think it's wicked cool when Black Adam punches a country to death or Superboy Prime cuts someone in half with heat vision, or rips someone's limbs off, but those fans can go watch Saw movies and stay the heck away from comic fandom. I would totally not pander to that segment. Superhero comic books are about *heroes.* Higher ideals. Great responsibilities. Truth, justice and the American way, and all that.
Grimdark fans can go watch bumfight videos on the internet.
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My changes for the DCU:
The Spectre is the only being that can freely transverse the Multiverse
Earth-Prime: Us. We read comics, wars happen and occasionally Lucas makes a good movie.
Earth-1: DCU Prime. Home of the “Modern-Age” Superman, Batman, WW, etc. An earth where the writers are allowed to make new stories without changing too many of the core origins about the characters (Superman is still from Krypton, WW is an Amazon, etc.).
Prominent Heroic and Villainous Characters on Earth-1
Lois Lane (Not married to Clark, maintain a flirtatious relationship)
Batman (Dick Grayson, Bruce retired and is still around, just being Bruce)
Robin (Damien Wayne)
Nightwing (Tim Drake)
Wonder Woman (Princess Diana)
Green Lanterns (Hal, Guy and John)
Flash (Wally West, Barry is still here, just in semi-retirement)
Aqua man (Garth, takes over for Arthur when he realizes he needs to be a king more.)
Hawkman (Katar Hol, Thanagarian)
Hawk girl (Shayera Hol, Thanagarian)
Atom (Ryan Choi/Ray Palmer is still around, just retired.)
Green Arrow (Oliver Queen)
Booster Gold
Blue Beetle (Jamie Reyes)
Elongated Man
J’onn J’onnz: Martian Manhunter
Green Lantern Corps and the Guardians
Lex Luthor
The Joker
Sinestro
Zoom
Harley Quinn (partner to The Joker)
Flash’s Rouges Gallery (Captain Cold, Heat Wave, Mirror Master, Captain Boomerang II)
Justice League (Superman (Chairman), Wonder Woman, Flash, Green Arrow, John Stewart, Batman, Atom and Aquaman)
Teen Titans (Nightwing, Kid Flash, Wonder Girl, Superboy [Connor Kent], Miss Martian and Speedy [Mia Dreden])
Legion of Doom (Lex Luthor, Zoom, Cheetah II, Deadshot, Doctor Light I, Black Manta
Earth-2: Home of the Golden-Age superheroes and their successors. Various WW2 superheroes existed and are now dead or retired (Hawkman I, Dr. Mid-Nite I, Hawkwoman, Wildcat I). Time moves slower on Earth-2 than on Earth-1. Due to the prevalence of more doubles on Earth-2, it is easier to travel between Earths 1 and 2.
Prominent Heroic and Villainous Characters on Earth-2
Lois Lane-Kent
Power Girl (Karen Kent, adopted daughter of Clark and Lois)
Robin (Dick Grayson)
Huntress (Helena Wayne)
Wonder Woman II (Hippolyta Trevor, daughter of the Original Wonder Woman)
Green Lantern II (Kyle Rayner/During the Crisis that created my DCU, he traveled to Earth-2 and took over for Alan Scott.)
Guardian of the Universe (Alan Scott/absorbs the Starheart energy and becomes the Earth-2 universes first Guardian)
Green Arrow I (Connor Hawke, caught in the same trap Kyle did)
Jesse Quick (Jesse Chambers, daughter of Johnny Quick and Liberty Belle)
Dr. Mid-Nite II (Dr. Peter Cross)
Mr. Terrific II (Micheal Holt)
Sandman II (Sandy Hawkins)
The Flash (Jay Garrick, retired and is the financer of the JSA)
Atom-Smasher (Albert Rothstein )
Aztek (caught in the same trap Kyle and Connor were)
Captain Marvel
Mary Marvel
Black Canary II (Dinah Laurel Lance, daughter of the original)
Plastic Man (Eel O’Brian, private detective)
Doll Man (Dr. Ray Palmer. Invents a shrinking serum to become the size of a doll)
Hourman II (Rick Tyler, Son of the original, Hourman I is in retirement)
The Guardian (Jim Harper, guy with the Golden Shield)
Jakeem Thunder and his Thunderbolt
Brainwave (Son of the original)
Zatanna (Zatanna Zatara, crossed over in the Crisis)
Jade (Jenny Hayden, daughter of Alan Scott)
Wildcat II (Jake Grant, son of the original, a were-panther)
Star Girl (formerly Star-Spangled Kid II, Courtney Whitmore, took up the mantle of Starman)
J’Emm Son of Saturn
Flamebird (Elizabeth Kane, formerly Bat-Girl and ex-partner to Robin)
Neptune Perkins (Earth-2’s Aquaman and ruler of Atlantis)
Obsidian (Todd Rice, Son of Alan Scott, let the darkness consume him and is now seeking his sisters death)
Alexis Luthor (Daughter of the deceased Alexei Luthor. Mortal enemy of Power Girl)
Effigy (crossed over in the Crisis, enemy of Kyle Rayner)
Dr. Sivana
Vandal Savage
Ultra-Humanite
Captain Nazi (Remnant of the Nazi regime that the JSA help foil in WW2, seeks revenge.)
Black Adam
Harlequin (daughter of the Joker, she seeks revenge on The Batman Legacy for foiling her father)
Justice Society of America: Been in existence since WW2 (Black Canary [Chairman], Robin, Power Girl, Green Lantern, Jesse Quick, Dr. Mid-Nite, Mr. Terrific, Aztek, Hourman, Doll Man, Zatanna)
Freedom Fighters: The Government’s Super Team (The Guardian [Chairman], Atom-Smasher, Captain Marvel, Brainwave, Jade, Star Girl)
Young Justice (Mary Marvel, Jakeem Thunder, Flamebird)
Injustice Syndicate of America (Alexis Luthor [Leader], Effigy, Harlequin, Obsidian, Black Adam, Icicle II)
Earth-3
Home of the CLA and criminal counterparts to heroes, See the DVD release of Justice League: Crisis on 2 Earths for how this world runs. Travel between the other Earths is extremely hard due to different energy wavelengths.
Prominent Heroic and Villainous Characters on Earth-3
Superwoman (Diana Lane)
Power Ring (Alan Stuart, ring is weak against the color Red, the color of will in this universe)
Johnny Quick
Owlman II (Jason Todd, former resident of Earth-1. Todd killed the original Owlman when he traveled here)
Alex Luthor (wears armor powered by Anti-Kryptonite, which harms Ultraman, leader of the Justice Gang)
The Jester (scarred by Owlman I, he decided to fight Owlman at every opportunity, member of the Justice Gang)
Captain Comet (formerly a resident of Earth-4, traveled here during the Crisis, member of the Justice Gang, physical match for Ultraman)
Blue Beetle (Dr. Dan Garrett, formerly a resident of Earth-2, was deceased until his scarab brought him back. Traveled here during the Crisis, member of the Justice Gang)
Red Arrow (Roy Harper, formerly Speedy I and a resident of Earth-1, traveled here during the Crisis chasing Jason Todd, had his arm re-grew by Alex Luthor)
Crime Legion Of America (Ultraman [Boss], Power Ring, Superwoman, Johnny Quick, Owlman II)
Justice Gang (Alex Luthor [Chairman], Captain Comet, Red Arrow, Blue Beetle, The Jester)
Earth-4
Home to the Legion. The DCU superheroes were comics in this reality, however, they inspire a team of young adults in the 31st Century to become THE LEGION OF SUPERHEROES. The founders traveled through the dimensional waves (they thought they were going through time) and met the Earth-2 Superboy. Subsequent travels sent them to Earth-1, where they met Superman and are connected to him. It is easier to travel to Earth-1 from here than any of the other earths.
Prominent Heroic and Villainous Characters on Earth-4
Cosmic Boy (Founder/Chairman)
Saturn Girl (Founder)
Lightning Lad (Founder)
Ferro
Wildfire
Valor/Mon-El (only survivor of Krypton in this reality)
Polar Boy
Sun Boy
XS
Brainiac 5
The Flash (John Fox, formerly from 835th Century of Earth-1, traveled here during the Crisis)
Marvel (formerly Captain Marvel, Jr. Resident of Earth-2, traveled here during the Crisis and is powered by this reality’s version of Shazam. Ally to the LOSH, protector of this reality‘s Metropolis.)
Reverse-Flash/Professor Zoom (Eobard Thawne, formerly from the 25th century future of Earth-1, traveled here in hopes of conquest and to ruin the name of the Flash.)
Mordru
Mongul
The other 48 Earths have yet to be catalogued.
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I wouldn't explicitly 'retire' anyone, but the majority of titles would have six to twelve issue runs, and the creators who want to work with those characters would have to pitch a story arc to warrant that title being printed. There would not *always* be a wandering often-mediocre monthly Wonder Woman or Green Lantern or Flash or Aquaman title, 'just because.' There would have to be an actual storyline already planned out for that.
When that storyline wraps up, if nobody has a sizzling cool idea for the next six or twelve issues of Flash, then there will not be a Flash #7 'fill-in artist' one-shot issue. Flash may appear as a guest-star in other books, or in team books that feature him, but he won't get a solo run again until someone comes up with a reason for him to have a solo run. There will be no scrambling for a new creative team to 'fill the hole' and string a book along on life-support. *When* a new team comes along with a red-hot pitch and fire in their bellies to tell stories about that character or team, *then* there will be a new six to twelve issue run for them.
The serial comic concept, I think, has run it's course.
I would be interested in seeing this. Very interested.
I'd also make an editorial mandate that killing characters will only occur when it's relevant to one of these story-arcs. Nobody would be expendable. No villain that nobody cares about would be 'fluffed up' by having them kill a half dozen Teen Titans.
Sure, there are fans that *love* that sort of thing, and think it's wicked cool when Black Adam punches a country to death or Superboy Prime cuts someone in half with heat vision, or rips someone's limbs off, but those fans can go watch Saw movies and stay the heck away from comic fandom. I would totally not pander to that segment. Superhero comic books are about *heroes.* Higher ideals. Great responsibilities. Truth, justice and the American way, and all that.
Grimdark fans can go watch bumfight videos on the internet.
I disagree with you here, but only slightly. I'm completely on board with people dying only when they're supposed to die, but I'm all for Superboy Prime kacking someone with heat vision or people dying graphically. Superheroics are hard work, and when you're dealing with funky powers that could, ostenibly, cleave someone in twain quite literally, I want to see that happen every now and again, otherwise I'm going to feel like I'm reading Power Rangers(note- NOT Sentai. The watered down American crap specifically). Not that I want everyone to die horribly every fifteen minutes(I have Gantz for that), but sometimes someone ends up being an object lesson. Not so much in the Cypher/Doug Ramsey fashion, but more in the Blue Beetle(I MISS YA TED!!!) fashion.
I'd do a Marvel Team-Up deal called "Lobo Vs." and have him frag a different character each month.
I'd reset it with an alternative continuity first to spark interest and then work it eventually so there would be an obvious passing of time allowing for character legacies to continue the series on as it continues.
By this I mean setting the first series in the present having the Justice League encounter its latest challenge but with a roster of say its led by the martian manhunter with Steel, Gipsy and their era which leads to a couple being killed leaving Martian Manhunter severely depressed enough to dismiss the current league and retire himself over the loss.
The true figures behind the league arrange for a new membership drive this time calling upon the more popular of the current era of heroes.
Namely recruit Nightwing, Superboy, Impulse, Wonder Girl, Beast Boy and Zatanna which leads into a mini series looking into the past of the league where we learn the Justice Society was the first Justice League which was eventually dismissed due to the McCarthy era.
The seventies brought about the Justice League led by Superman, Wonder Woman, Batman, Aquaman, Green Lantern II (Hal Jordan), The Flash II (Barry Allen) and the Martian Manhunter.
However the Superman of this team is actually Kal-l who first appeared during the second world war along with Wonder Woman. The Batman was also from that period but has been replaced by his son Damien whose a little too bloodthirsty for the original trio's liking which is why they're still involved in the League of the 70's after Hippolyta's daughter was kidnapped off of Themyscira where she was being raised after Diana's relationship with Steve Trevor ended since he couldn't travel to the island and Hippolyta as queen of the amazons chose her people over her love.
The daughter would eventually become the Wonder Woman of the early 21st century.
The League of the 90's was led by Superman II (Kal-El) also the son of Kal-l later aided by Kal-l's cousin Kara who was thus Kal-El's Aunt and would eventually let her niece assume the role of Supergirl so that she would become Power Girl instead.
The violence and bitter tragedies of this decade would be responsible for the gradual erosion of morale upbringing in the society such that at one point heroes actually killed villains which led to far greater acts of tragedy until the original Superman and his dying nemesis Lex Luthor I joined forces to condemn the vicious cycle managing to force the worlds governments to agree to a multinational body that would supervise and try to contain where it could not help guide those powered beings who continued this cycle of violence and pointless cruelty.
The body is eventually named Checkmate and in honour of its first leader the title of anyone assuming the post of director of the organisation is named Mr Terrific which was accepted following the death of the founding director in preventing the use of an old american satellite program codenamed "OMAC" to wipe out almost 75% of the population at the whim of an ancient supervillain known only as the Dragon King.
The comic series would eventually be set in various periods including the present.
So the present would include;
Superboy: Long thought to be the son of Kal-El his past will eventually reveal he is just one of many of Lex Luthor II's experiments to duplicate the House of El's powers. Adopted by Kal-El's mother Lois, his rebellious teenage years has left him at odds with his adopted father and brother fortunately his aunt keeps an even hand on him whilst he's away from home but his recent promotion to the new league seems to be just another way to keep him grounded something he is fighting bitterly against.
Superman: Kal-El has become more isolated ever since his nemesis Lex Luthor II went into hiding once Checkmate was founded and he is trying to keep his private life away from the publicity of his heroic guise.
What with Maxima visiting in attempts to secure Kal-El as her husband he finds himself much preferring to stay away from metropolis and haunt his father's Fortress of Solitude even as the world is changing far too much for his liking.
Batman: Damien is still in the role but in the background his father Bruce realising he has few years left is trying his best to set the plans for that eventuality going so far as being one of three people behind the Justice League's shadowy governing council. With Damien trying to cope with a world that really doesn't like him and Gotham is slowly slipping into a perpectual criminal haven he is searching for the means to regain control unaware that he's the problem.
Added to this mess he at his father's behest has been training a number of sidekicks only for some to turn evil or mercenary rather than tolerate his rather severe mannerisms.
The new robin is busy with the junior justice league better known as the Teen Titans whilst the Red Robin is Damien's new sidekick.
Teen Titans: Led originally by Nightwing the group has changed since the early seventies currently the group is little more than a propaganda group to highlight the change in the world's outlook.
Once they included Robin I (Later known as Nightwing), Beast Boy, Cyborg, Kid Flash (later known as Flash III), Aqualad (later known as Aquaman II), Wonder Girl (Later known as Wonder Woman III or Donna Troy, a clone of Hippolyta's daughter Diana also known as Wonder Woman II)
I think I'm getting too far ahead of myself!
[quote=]Teen Titans: Led originally by Nightwing the group has changed since the early seventies currently the group is little more than a propaganda group to highlight the change in the world's outlook.
Once they included Robin I (Later known as Nightwing), Beast Boy, Cyborg, Kid Flash (later known as Flash III), Aqualad (later known as Aquaman II), Wonder Girl (Later known as Wonder Woman III or Donna Troy, a clone of Hippolyta's daughter Diana also known as Wonder Woman II)
Okay the original Teen Titans consisted of the sidekicks of the Justice League, this went out of the window by the time Beast Boy joined following him being the only surviving member of the Doom Patrol which would later discover had been betrayed by a member of the patrol who would eventually assume the guise of Madame Rouge of the Brotherhood of Evil.
The group would later expand to a team on each coast and tentative attempts to create similar groups abroad being firmly rebuffed due to excessive attempts to keep them under American control.
This doesn't stop teams being founded abroad with Justice League Europe working for a little while until it was almost completely wiped out by the Legion of Doom and was left inactive because of the same problems the Teen Titans Europe team initative faced.
Green Arrow: Oliver Queen was another of the backer's of the Justice League his son Connor assumes his identity as the Green Arrow seeking to fight injustice however the shadowy elements of the US Government force him to establish a group to work outside the system and with Bruce Wayne's begrudging aide establishes the Outsiders even as his son copes with his patrolling across Star City with his normal life as well as coping with his father's wife (who isn't his mother by the way) and the Black Canary as part of her time away from her job as a florist works part time with the Birds of Prey group which was established by her, the original Bat Girl and Huntress.
Birds of Prey: A mercenary group who are trying to prevent the collapse of the world's governments at the hands of various malevolent factions some of hire them to counter their rival's actions sort of an unarmored knights sabers group if you want a comparison.
Past
House of El: Kal-l arrived in an escape pod in the early twenties, found by a farmer and his wife he is placed in an orphanage where he grows up aware of the perils of everyday life. Like every able bodied person he enlists in the war and discovers his powers managin to hide his identity with the help of a few friends. This comic starts off with his origin and then shifts to different periods depending on the story the idea is that it eventually explains how he discovered his powers, how he copes with them, how he became part of the justice society, explains how he kept his identity secret whilst other members didn't and what happened to them.
He eventually settles down and marries Lois Lane a reporter he met during the war but only after the war whilst they were friends it never became serious until both were ready (about the late fifties or early sixties I figure) this leads to the birth of Kal-El however not before he discovers his origin thanks to the arrival of his cousin Kara later named Karen Starr whose escape pod was delayed a few decades behind her infant cousin.
Krypton was destroyed in a bitter civil war, Kal-El's father sent both him and Kara offworld to escape the reach of the new ruler General Zod and Kara could only watch the gradually fading broadcasts as her pod fled the system as their family were killed along with many others in the bombing of Kandor.
Kal-l has a second child and with Lois's agreement she is named Kara after her aunt who will eventually pass her title as supergirl to her niece and assumes the name power girl instead.
During the seond world war Kal-l earned the emnity of a german born scientist named Alexander Luthor, following the war he immigrated to the US and used his technical brilliance to build a corporation named Lexcorp since naming it Luthorcorp might draw unnecessary attention to his past.
Left bald following an incident during the war which he blamed Kal-l for, this incident was used to make those hunting for him think he was dead. The animosity spread to the rest of Kal-l's family but when necessary he was prepared to aid his nemesis especially when other kryptonians tried to invade earth using a device stowed aboard kara's pod by her father.
Krypton was destroyed but not before the surviving residents fled inside the Phantom Zone, kara's father stowed the device aboard her pod as part of a scheme to save himself only to be slain by Zod himself once they fled inside unaware that since Kara's father was the only member of the El family left alive he was also the only one who could release them so the surviving Kryptonians had to wait until Kal-El accidentally found and activated the device.
It was the reason for the creation of the Fortress of Solitude especially after Luthor tried repeatedly to secure any Kryptonian artefacts for his nefarious use.
The Justice Society: Founded during the 2nd world war it was intended as a counter to the German, Italian, Japanese and early Russian superpowered teams.
When the Germans turned on the Russians the Russians became allies until shortly after the 2nd world war ended as both they and the US bitterly bickered over the remains of the three countries they had fought.
The Society remained operational until the time of Senator McCarthy who at the behest of Goverment and Corporate interests sought control over the powerful group, its subsequently dismissed its members most of whom retired and took great efforts to remain undiscovered by the angered McCarthy loyalists.
The establishing of the Justice League in the 70's brought this group back together as their differing views sought a place where they could do something about a world that was changing in ways they considered dangerously unwise.
Unlike the League they would remain very secretive and have strong links with Checkmate as a means of keeping that group in line as the world seems intent on going down the drain quite literally!
Future:
The Legion: A thousand years from now humanity has spread to the stars however Earth was lost to them many years past but its legends continue to prosper. A trio of youths whose homeworld had adapted them with remarkable gifts decide to use them for the common good and aving the life of a wealthy patron he helps establish them as the Legion.
Seeking to promote the good of society its opened to a single member of each world and member of the United Planets expanding its membership eventually to a few hundred but due to the size of the UP they're separated as group in smaller numbers so they can do the kost good.
Initially its mostly PR but when events turn bad some of their number decide to the right thing and try to help.
These brave people are known as the Legion of Superheroes but where there are good there is also the bad as some rejected as members along with criminal elements found their nemesis team.
In a society that has lost almost everything they know about their original homeworld the only knowledge they do have speak of the heroes of the past and it is this they seek to honour even as both their sponsor and the government of the Up seek to use them to their best benefit and their backers don't like their charges trying to sort out messes some of which they committed for their own purposes and don't want them resolved by well meaning kids when they have their own ends to serve...
As i said before I still think I'm getting ahead of myself there!
Really, really need to read that thread regarding the LOSH though!!
Freehold_DM: I'm honored to be a contributor to your Wonder Woman continuity.
Of course. Only the best for such an iconic character. I'm big enough to admit I don't "get" her and that I think she's a rather complicated character given her backstory and feminist philosophy intertwinings.
From what I know of, the only time we see anything at all from any earth other than Earth 1, is when it somehow has something to do with Earth 1. Doesnt earth 2 have its own stories that dont neccessarily have to be told to Earth 1 people as 'backstory'? Cant we have stuff that is actually happening there?
Back in the 1970s, Earth-2 had some nifty stories going on, with no connection to Earth-1. Paul Levitz wrote some great JSA stories. In those, the Batman of Earth-2 actually died. PERMANENTLY. How cool is that?!? Alternate realities allow you to tell all kinds of nifty stories that would otherwise be unthinkable!
And Batman was succeeded by his daughter (from his marriage to Catwoman, also deceased) the Huntress, who also had her own series in the late 70s and early 80s, also written by Levitz. (Okay, so it was mostly backup stories in the pages of Wonder Woman, but still...)
And the Earth-2 Superman, looking older and married to Lois, had his own stories in the pages of Superman Family. That comic had a feature called "Mr. and Mrs. Superman."
And then, of course, in the 1980s, Roy Thomas came in with his "All-Star Squadron" and "Infinity Inc" titles. So Earth-2 was a really "happening" place, before the COIE messed all that up.
So yes, DC did have some stories to tell about Earth-2. And that's the way it should be, I agree.
Golden age characters should be placed where they belong..in the golden age..so in my reboot time moves slower on Earth 2's timeline and they are still in WW2.
I noticed something strange about the reboot cover for JLI though..the online versions show Mary Marvel in the black costume she gained after getting Black Adams powers..but the 'Previews' cover version has a blank space where she should be..and there no Marvel Family book at all.
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I was thinking of asking this very same question. I'm almost glad I didn't because most of you know more about DC then I'll ever know. That being said I just have put in my hat, for what its worth.
1. First start from scratch in terms or your primary earth. Everything that's gone before can be said to have happaned somewere else. This isn't going to make fans happy but it will give a starting point.
2. In a perfect world without market demands, fan demands, and simple finicial suicide DC starts with 1 comic, 1 superhero, Superman. Yeah it sucks but if the man in blue is going to be the guy all others are measured by then there has to be a reason. Think of it this way if JSA worked during WWII then supermans first apparance wouldn't be that impressive to the world at large. A year later first isssue of Detective comics (no roben until year four with Dick).
3. DC cannot do #2 so something has to devised. My solution, come out with a series of Year One books, or declare other year one titles to be offical. Batman Year One works fine because it steps on no ones toes, Man of Steel I'm less sure about. In any case then have ongoing series, but the ongoing will be more or less Year 5 or 10. Thus Bats and Superman and wonderwomen will have been around. ACtually I'd go year five, most of the major DC heros will have come out by then, but most if not all will not have meet each other yet.
4. Decide who is know by year 5. By know I mean which heors are actively being heros. My basic list, I'll keep to 10
Superman (first superhero came out in the new Year one)
Batman (maybe doing stuff in year one, but as batman year two)
Wondewomen (year two)
Auqoman (Year two)
Green Arrow (Year Three)
Flash (Year Three)
Green Latern (Year Four)
Hawkman (Year Four)
Robin (Year Five)
Captain Marvel (Year Five)
5. This makes it easy to start new stroylines for everyother hero they want to introduce as it is now year five and new heros can come out. And it leaves open hidden unknown players such as DR. Fate or the Spector, oh they've been around for a long time, but now one knew it.
6. DC will have to decide how long it wants to wait for new versions of old charactes can come in. New Green Lanter year 12. New Robin year 11. so on and so forth. They don't have to plan everthing out but have some sort of time table.
7. No Teams. Yeah this one no one will like, but I simply wouldn't have these hoers know each other much less be working together already. Just think about it for a moment, the first major crisis (pun not intended) that the world will face, and that will cause a crossover will be the orgion of the JLA. Then you start the JLA title, it'll have an offical self contained history.
Not that it matters, because I have no say but thats how I'd outline the rules (open for debate and suggestions of course).
TTFN DRE
Golden age characters should be placed where they belong..in the golden age..so in my reboot time moves slower on Earth 2's timeline and they are still in WW2.
I just posted my idea, and you read it you'd note I disagree with you, no golden age for me.
Having said that I know perfectly well that'll never happen and that your idea of the golden age charactes being placed in the golden age would be far more acceptable. No argument on that; but I do have a question, not just to you but anyone who'd have some idea.
Question is basicaly this; Who would you have in the Silver, Broze and as M&M likes to call it iron ages.
What I mean is DC as fairly established what characters existed in the golden age, but with the reboot I'm going to assmue that most 'moden' heors have come out since 2000. So what list of heros works for.....
The Silver age 1954 to 1973
The Bronze age 1974 to 1985+ or -
The Iron Age 1985 to 2000
You can say the golden age heros were around in WWII but thats now 60+ years ago are we to assume that no other superheors came out in that time?
If Not who would be the hero list for those ages? Knowing that by putting such a hero in such a category forever locks him in that time period. Sure you can still tell stories with that caracter but it would be in that era.
For example: I'd put Hal Jorden and Berry Alen/ Green Latern and Flash as silver age heors. Whoever has those titles in 2011 will not be those two charactes, and both are most likely dead or retired completly. Stories can still be told with them, but they are no longer part of current DC universe.
Are we even ready to lock some of the iconics to differnt eras?
TTFN DRE
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Andre, your idea confuses me.
Are you talking about real life years that DC would only make certain comics? So if you were in charge of DC right now, in two months, youd have them stop making any and all comics that werent Superman? A year later in Sept 2012 they could start with Batman, and then work from there with everyone else?
If Im reading this right, DC will have nosedived into the concrete before December. Not all DC fans read Superman, and even fewer would be satisfied with JUST Superman comics for a solid year. That would alienate a HUGE portion of their fanbase.
Andre, your idea confuses me.
Are you talking about real life years that DC would only make certain comics? So if you were in charge of DC right now, in two months, youd have them stop making any and all comics that werent Superman? A year later in Sept 2012 they could start with Batman, and then work from there with everyone else?
If Im reading this right, DC will have nosedived into the concrete before December. Not all DC fans read Superman, and even fewer would be satisfied with JUST Superman comics for a solid year. That would alienate a HUGE portion of their fanbase.
Basically yes, but as I said in my post this will not happen for the same reason you mentioned. Money and fan-base. I'm talking in a perfect world. Heck I'm not even a Superman fan, but he is number one, and historically I think he was the first superhero, at lest what we think of as superhero, I'm not sure of what Pulp heores that predate superman have made their way to current timelines.
But also as I said since you really cannot do that for bussines reason, start at Year Five.
TTFN DRE
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I haven't read all the posts prior yet but thought I'd toss my hat in the ring.
I would eliminate fake cities.
I would pick a central hub or two and put everyone there.
I would have a major A-list hero be gay.
I would feature a strong female character (and not just as a sex kitten).
I would power down Superman.
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I would only do about 12 titles not 52 and they'd be complete and total reboots. No other comic or movie version would count towards continuity.
I'd probably just do
Batman
Superman
Wonder Woman
Green Lantern
Justice League
Aquaman
Catwoman
Captain Marvel
Flash
Black Panther
Jonah Hex
Animal Man =p
Black Panther is Marvel, not DC.
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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I could write a much larger post, but I think two or three worlds would work.
Earth-Origins.
Batman, basically from the beginning. Introduce Dick in a couple years, then Barbara. Bruce is going to be 20-25 in this version, and not quiet as dark to start.
Superman - essentially what Grant Morrison is doing.
Wonder Woman - Themascyra has been hidden from Man's world for centuries, but someone* has stolen various artifacts from the island revealing it to the world. Young Diana is sent to find the artifacts and save the island.**
The Flash - Barry Allen kind of CSI meets superheroics. He'd be in his 30's
Green Lantern - Hal Jordan. Colonel Hal Jordan, USAF, in his 40's.
Earth- Experienced. The timeline here moves faster so...
Justice League - Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Flash (Wally West) Green Lantern (John Stewart). Higher powered adventures, A rotating cast bringing it to 7 or nine members, with the others picked from the DCU to spotlight. Batman is about 40, as is Kal-El. Wonder Woman doesn't age, and John Stewart is about 30. Edit, Hal Jordan would be retired/on Oa (50's or 60's) and Barry would be mostly retired.
Titans - Dick, Kory, Jessie Quick*** Victor, Gar, Garth. A bit lower power, more family than the JL. If the JL are the big guns (The earth is about to hit the moon!) They are more local, (The Rogues are about to rob Ft Knox!)
Outsiders: Roy Harper, Metamorpho, Obsidian, Grace, Thunder, rotating cast. The 'black ops' team. This is the team that would go after Lex Luthor. To big to take down publicly? Don't want an international incident? These guys. Character driven. They're also the grey area. Need to track down slave traders in Africa? They might hire/abduct Catman. Need to do a green lantern style thing w/o green lanterns, well if we mug Sinestro and take his ring...
Justice League International - Vixen, Congrorilla, Dr. Light, August General in Red Iron, Fire, Ice, others. "The official UN Sponsored Justice League!" With all the political intrigue that implies. What if they're sent to protect weapons inspectors and the Outsiders are going to blow up the weapons caches? What if the UN votes that Black Adam joins the group, etc.
Teen Titans- Tim, Cassie Sandmark, Kon-El, Bart, Static, Raven*, others. The 'kids treehouse' and they hate being thought of that way. Tim's idea is that they can reach out to the new generation of metahumans. The new generation has other ideas... lots of tie in with the Titans book, sometimes to their annoyances.
Birds of Prey: Oracle, Huntress, Spoiler, Zindra, Ravager, Proxy, rotating. Another covert team, but not as dark as Outsiders. Oracle is Barbara Gordon, and Spoiler is Stephanie Brown, but they also show up in the Detective comics as Batwoman (meaning there are two Batwomen) and Batgirl.
Detective Comics - two ten page stories a month, rotating creators. Here you get the Batfamily, the Question, Detective Chimp, Blue Beetle (Ted Kord) Zatanna, Deadman etc. Focus on mystery style adventure.
Action Comics - a 'high superheroic' adventure comic. The super family, Captain Atom, New gods, etc. Also more futuristic.
House of Secrets - Not the Secret Six, but a magic version of Action and Detective. Maybe do 10 pages Constantine with a rotating 10 page back up.
Vilians United - A book for the bad guys. again the 10 and 10 format, with a mix. 6 months of a Luthor main story, followed by a one shot of how the Joker sees Batman? Sure.
Edit- forgot Galactic Guardians - the deep space anthology book. Adam Strange, Guy Guardner, Green Lantern Corps Hawkgirl (I'd use the DCAU version as a base) etc.
Earth Elseworld - a catch all universe.
JSA/Infinity Inc/3rd book, three books dealing with the JSA (40's and 50's) Infinity Inc (60's - 70's) and the third unnamed book (80's-90's) Some of the teams are going to have three generations of heroes (Alan Scott/Jade&Obsidian***/third generation, etc) The books will have character crossovers. Alan Scott might be active in JSA, mentoring in Infinity, passing his ring on to his Grandson in book three, etc.
They'll also play fast and loose with history. Perhaps this Earth's Superman died in WW II trying to stop a Japanese Nuke, Per Degaton sank Ireland, etc.
Legion of SuperHeroes. This book would be unique, in the 31st century, the parallel earths are better known, and crossovers happen. 31st century Earth beginnings Dawnstar will be different than Elseworlds Dawnstar, but can they team up to save Experienced Timber Wolf?
That would be to start, other pitches would get their own series and treatment. Martian Manhunter's adventures in Detective and Action sell well and someone wants to do a 12 issue series? Let him at it! Batwoman proves popular enough for her own book, sure! Gail wants to do more Secret Six? She can! etc. The five anthologies would also be a way to circulate characters and new creative teams.
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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You could do something like that, but wouldn't it just lead to more confusion and be harder for a new reader to get into.
You know: Why are there two Robins?, etc
You'd still have all the confusion in your "Experienced" world about what the actual past of the heroes was.
And then there would be the crossovers...
Ten years from now, you could have a huge event to straighten out all the confusing timelines, parallel earths and messed up back story.
Yes, the Ultimates line has caused no end of headaches for Marvel :P
Less Snarky, my thought was that if the books are marked with a logo Origins/Experienced/Elseworlds it would make more sense.
As to the multiple Batwomen/Robins/etc. The past would be such in Experienced that they happened, but not the same way.
Origins Flash may never get a Kid Flash, but Experienced Flash was mentored by Barry Allen, who is retired, slower, and enjoying his kids and grandkids.
Origins Batman would find Dick Greyson in the circus but his mom survived and was crippled, Experienced Nightwing lost both of his parents before he became Robin and Tim volunteered when Dick became Nightwing, etc.
(Aside, that to me was one of the coolest parts of Tim's origin, that he chose to be Robin, after figuring out Robin was Dick Greyson.)
Bascially it gives the writers the ability to play off each other, (Experienced Nightwing talks about 'that time when we barely got away from the giant robot' and Origins Batman and Robin then encounter the robot a year later.) but also allows flexibility. ("Granpa Barry, why did you retire?" "Captain Boomerang broke my knee and dang thing never healed right, still hurts when it rains, too." Meanwhile Origins Barry seems destined for that fate, but avoids it, etc.)
Plus it would be funny as heck if Kate-Batwoman and Barbara-Batwoman were both investigating the same case w/o knowing it. ("What do you mean, tell you what I know?" The thug stammers, "I just did!" Barbara noticed the stain and smell of urine, someone had apparently scared the truth out of him, but who?)
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Earth-3
Home of the CLA and criminal counterparts to heroes, See the DVD release of Justice League: Crisis on 2 Earths for how this world runs. Travel between the other Earths is extremely hard due to different energy wavelengths.
I would read the hell out of a book set on Earth 3, with evil versions of standard heroes and heroic versions of standard villains, fighting in an underground resistance against the superbeings that rule their world. (The Flash's Rogues Gallery as a team of tech-powered underground resistance fighters against the tyranny of their world's psychotic Johnny Quick? Awesome!)
Random thoughts on Earth 3 'evil' Titans;
Starfire - half-Tamaranian / half-Okaaran warlord, part of the ruling caste of several Vegan worlds, one of dozens of royal brats who use a combination of technology and genetic enhancements (provided by enslaved Psions) to prove themselves 'most fit to rule,' generally by arranging fatal accidents for their siblings. Her pet project is to set up Earth for conquest by the empire, which ensures that she will be allowed to rule it, rather than fight her siblings for control of a Vegan world.
Cyborg - chemically-enhanced athlete, visiting dad's lab to score some designer drugs, was partially devoured by an extradimensional entity, and outfitted by his father with the extradimensional alloy they were constructing in the space the entity came from, trade-named Harmonium, a metal that absorbs kinetic impact (within reason) and converts it to harmonic sound, allowing 'Cyborg' to aborb massive impacts and convert them into sonic attacks.
Changeling - the amorphous entity that devoured Victor Stone's limbs (and his mother, entirely) barely survived the closing of the portal that had brought only a part of its bulk into this dimension. It visited Victor (in his mother's form) throughout his long convalescence, and they have an unhealthy sort of psychological relationship, both being individuals who consider themselves more or less inhuman (rightly, in Changeling's case). Changeling 'officially' can only turn into bright red animals, but is quite capable of assuming the forms (and gaining some memories) from anyone it consumes, such as Victor's mother.
Raven - sent to Earth to be raised by kindly mystics by her father Trigon, she learned the various rites and procedures they were using to keep him at bay and then killed them all. She has yet to perform the rites necessary (or even to finish collecting the components needed) to open the doors and unleash her father on this dimension, because she has not yet wrung from him the concessions that she believes she deserves for this act. She typically remains in her red-skinned, cloven-hooved, four-eyed and antlered half-demon form, only disguising herself as a human girl when she needs to for purposes of subterfuge. Her signature move is to engulf others in her darksoul, which inflicts on them the sensation of burning to death, and can kill someone through psychic shock, if she so chooses.
I really like the ideas of Action/ Detective/ and House of Secrets focusing on short story lines centered on other heroes of DC universe. Detective always was a Batman title for me, and Action was a Superman team up book. Perhaps that has changed, but the reboot certainly did not change my impressions.
I also love Set's idea of writing for a story and not so much for a serial. Here is the plan and you have 12-18-24-whatever issues to get it done. I think this would be great. As much as I liked Aquaman's first issue ( stunned as I always disliked this character ) I think it would be great like this. Eighteen issues to reaquaint himself with his human side and for the people of the community to learn to respect and possibly even admire this hero.
All that said though, one of my favorite comics was a filler one. Batman/Bruce was tired and just wanted to get some sleep but everything seemed to work against him.
Oh, and gotta have PowerGirl. Just finished reading some of her title and some JSA's from a buddy. Good stuff.
Greg
I'd make a Lobo "Marvel Team-Up" type book; each month Lobo would frag a different character in the DC universe.
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I like your evil Titans, Set.
Thanks!
So is Trigon good in this case, or is this the Trigon we know and loath, just with another Raven.
I had intended for the Trigon to be the same old Trigon, but it would be all kinds of appropriate for Raven to be the spawn of a goodly angelic entity that sent her to the world as his harbinger, to 'open the way' for his arrival to save the world, only to have his daughter be corrupted by the nature of Earth 3 (and the desire to continue using her otherworldly powers to impose her will on the lessers here, without daddy coming and turning the place into paradise and relegating her to a subordinate in his new world order...) and choose to *not* 'open the way' and keep the world the fun cesspool that she's come to appreciate.
That's a totally neat spin on anti-Raven. Someone with angelic powers, that she has perverted to evil, and who is actively opposing her fathers wishes to make the world a better place!
Perhaps she's associated with a Dove, instead of a Raven...
Anywho, Crime Syndicate Earth. Woo. What a playground! An underground Rogues Gallery of freedom fighters against the tyrannical 'Justice League?' A Bizarro-clone of Ultraman as the 'Frankenstein's Monster' of the setting, monstrous in appearance, but noble at heart? Dark eyed scale-skinned Aquaman, Abomination-King of the Atlantean Deep Ones?
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I like your evil Titans, Set.Thanks!
So is Trigon good in this case, or is this the Trigon we know and loath, just with another Raven.I had intended for the Trigon to be the same old Trigon, but it would be all kinds of appropriate for Raven to be the spawn of a goodly angelic entity that sent her to the world as his harbinger, to 'open the way' for his arrival to save the world, only to have his daughter be corrupted by the nature of Earth 3 (and the desire to continue using her otherworldly powers to impose her will on the lessers here, without daddy coming and turning the place into paradise and relegating her to a subordinate in his new world order...) and choose to *not* 'open the way' and keep the world the fun cesspool that she's come to appreciate.
That's a totally neat spin on anti-Raven. Someone with angelic powers, that she has perverted to evil, and who is actively opposing her fathers wishes to make the world a better place!
Perhaps she's associated with a Dove, instead of a Raven...
Anywho, Crime Syndicate Earth. Woo. What a playground! An underground Rogues Gallery of freedom fighters against the tyrannical 'Justice League?' A Bizarro-clone of Ultraman as the 'Frankenstein's Monster' of the setting, monstrous in appearance, but noble at heart? Dark eyed scale-skinned Aquaman, Abomination-King of the Atlantean Deep Ones?
You could even take a C-D list superhero and send them to Earth-3. They could either get killed off by the CSA or turn into heroes of that world.
I'd be willing to set up a PayPal fund to raise money for Aaron Diaz to buy DC and reboot the Justice League along these lines:
http://dresdencodak.tumblr.com/post/10979241054/rebooting-the-justice-leagu e
As to "Why nobody ever gets written out of comic books..."
These characters are trademarked. If they don't get something with their name and likeness published periodically (roughly once every 7 to 12 years depending on circumstances), the trademarks lapse...and ownership gets a might bit trickier.
I'd be willing to set up a PayPal fund to raise money for Aaron Diaz to buy DC and reboot the Justice League along these lines:
http://dresdencodak.tumblr.com/post/10979241054/rebooting-the-justice-leagu e
Wow, thanks for the post. His suggestions are more on the line of what I thought DC was going to do. Kind of like Ultimates are doing for Marvel.
I don't like all his suggestions, but I do like that it has many points of commonality between characters. I like the inclusion of a galaxy spanning agent of destruction. I like that origins are "similar" but are different enough one may take new directions with the characters.
This is more of what I expected as opposed to the hodgepodge that DC came up with.
Greg
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I'd be willing to set up a PayPal fund to raise money for Aaron Diaz to buy DC and reboot the Justice League along these lines:
http://dresdencodak.tumblr.com/post/10979241054/rebooting-the-justice-leagu e
I love his marble-statue Wonder Woman. Cyborg looked very steampunk, which is *totally* not what I'd expect, and therefore, totally intrigues me.
Wizard magazine's 'Ultimate DC' characters were intriguing (and prettily drawn) as well, back in the day.
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As to "Why nobody ever gets written out of comic books..."
These characters are trademarked. If they don't get something with their name and likeness published periodically (roughly once every 7 to 12 years depending on circumstances), the trademarks lapse...and ownership gets a might bit trickier.
Same reason nobody is every really allowed to undergo any lasting change.
Spider-Man gets a new black costume that's *hella* cooler-looking than his old one? Can't last. Messes with the branding. He's lucky they don't make him go back to the armpit-webs...
Professor X is downloaded into a clone body / cured of his spinal damage by Shiar technology / can walk again because of a mutant healer? Oh no, it's back in the saddle again, chuck-a-rooni, 'cause that wheelchair is part of your 'iconic' image.
Any telepath can cure Cyclops of his mental problem with controlling his eyebeams (and it can also be surgically corrected)? Too bad that will never happen (for long).
The last few years worth of stuff involving Hal Jordan and Barry Allen has similarly worked extra hard to set things back to the way things were. Aquaman's back in the orange and green, has his hand back *and* cut his hair and beard off.
Both companies treat their biggest characters more as 'brands' and less as characters, making any sort of lasting character growth, development or evolution, even something as simple as an update to their costume, all-but impossible.
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My ideas..
Ongoing comics..
Action comics focusing on Superman and related characters.
Detective comics focusing on Batman and related characters.
The Brave and the Bold focusing on Earth 3 stories generally with multiple characters.
All Star comics focusing on Earth 2 stories generally with multiple characters.
Worlds Finest Focusing on Earth 1 stories generally with multiple characters.
The stories would all be short maybe 3 issues of over lap.
Any other stories would be limited issues maybe 6 to 12 issues.
I would also separate the characters into at least 3 worlds, the JLA world, the JSA world(minus any characters in the JLA world) and A world where all the other characters, be they new or just unable to fit anywhere else.
I would adjust the characters a bit to allow for a non euro-centric look to all the characters. But only where it makes some sort of sense. Batman would not all of a sudden become Egyptian for example, but ras al ghul would look a lot less British. Wonder Woman would be drawn with a much more Greek look to her. Ect...
My ideas..
Ongoing comics..
Action comics focusing on Superman and related characters.
Detective comics focusing on Batman and related characters.
The Brave and the Bold focusing on Earth 3 stories generally with multiple characters.
All Star comics focusing on Earth 2 stories generally with multiple characters.
Worlds Finest Focusing on Earth 1 stories generally with multiple characters.The stories would all be short maybe 3 issues of over lap.
Any other stories would be limited issues maybe 6 to 12 issues.
I would also separate the characters into at least 3 worlds, the JLA world, the JSA world(minus any characters in the JLA world) and A world where all the other characters, be they new or just unable to fit anywhere else.
I would adjust the characters a bit to allow for a non euro-centric look to all the characters. But only where it makes some sort of sense. Batman would not all of a sudden become Egyptian for example, but ras al ghul would look a lot less British. Wonder Woman would be drawn with a much more Greek look to her. Ect...
I would also bring back the DCAU to comics permanently to keep certain universes and character incarnations alive.
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I would also bring back the DCAU to comics permanently to keep certain universes and character incarnations alive.My ideas..
Ongoing comics..
Action comics focusing on Superman and related characters.
Detective comics focusing on Batman and related characters.
The Brave and the Bold focusing on Earth 3 stories generally with multiple characters.
All Star comics focusing on Earth 2 stories generally with multiple characters.
Worlds Finest Focusing on Earth 1 stories generally with multiple characters.The stories would all be short maybe 3 issues of over lap.
Any other stories would be limited issues maybe 6 to 12 issues.
I would also separate the characters into at least 3 worlds, the JLA world, the JSA world(minus any characters in the JLA world) and A world where all the other characters, be they new or just unable to fit anywhere else.
I would adjust the characters a bit to allow for a non euro-centric look to all the characters. But only where it makes some sort of sense. Batman would not all of a sudden become Egyptian for example, but ras al ghul would look a lot less British. Wonder Woman would be drawn with a much more Greek look to her. Ect...
Such as?
Such as?I would also bring back the DCAU to comics permanently to keep certain universes and character incarnations alive.My ideas..
Ongoing comics..
Action comics focusing on Superman and related characters.
Detective comics focusing on Batman and related characters.
The Brave and the Bold focusing on Earth 3 stories generally with multiple characters.
All Star comics focusing on Earth 2 stories generally with multiple characters.
Worlds Finest Focusing on Earth 1 stories generally with multiple characters.The stories would all be short maybe 3 issues of over lap.
Any other stories would be limited issues maybe 6 to 12 issues.
I would also separate the characters into at least 3 worlds, the JLA world, the JSA world(minus any characters in the JLA world) and A world where all the other characters, be they new or just unable to fit anywhere else.
I would adjust the characters a bit to allow for a non euro-centric look to all the characters. But only where it makes some sort of sense. Batman would not all of a sudden become Egyptian for example, but ras al ghul would look a lot less British. Wonder Woman would be drawn with a much more Greek look to her. Ect...
Animated Series Batman, Justice League, Teen Titans...and Brave and the Bold too.