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Where in the rules can i explicitly find the number of monster attacks based on whether its a standard action or a full round action, based on the Pathfinder RPG stat blocks including cases of multi-attack feats.
This question is with regard to the number of attacks a creature gets i.e. a Pathfinder Bestiary creature might get +7claw +7 claw +7 bite +7 tailslap etc. Usually a standard action and a move allows 1 attack e.g. 1 bite or 1 claw. In cases of multi-attack that increases. Where in the rules is the exact detail on this. (If listing page numbers, please list the print version 1st or 4th, thx.)
A very basic question, I realize. I'm just trying to pin down the definitions, since the Bestiaries seem to lack the "OR" statements, favoring instead to simply list all the attacks. Its probably a very simple answer. Thanks for your help.
Pax
P 182-184 of the core book.
on 184 top left column is about multiple attacks states you must use full attack action in order to get more than one attack. No special is listed there or in the section on Nat. Attacks on p 182 so you must Full attack to get them all.
Where in the rules can i explicitly find the number of monster attacks based on whether its a standard action or a full round action, based on the Pathfinder RPG stat blocks including cases of multi-attack feats.
I may well be ninjaed, but, you want to start with the Combat Section in the Core Rules
This is the most relevant passage:
Multiple Attacks: A character who can make more than one attack per round must use the full-attack action (see Full-Round Actions) in order to get more than one attack.
It's confusing because the wording in the core rules is designed more for players than GMs, but "creature" also can be substituted for "character." (To the best of my knowledge) Any creature with multiple attacks can only make all attacks as a full-attack action.
This question is with regard to the number of attacks a creature gets i.e. a Pathfinder Bestiary creature might get +7claw +7 claw +7 bite +7 tailslap etc. Usually a standard action and a move allows 1 attack e.g. 1 bite or 1 claw. In cases of multi-attack that increases.
If you are referring to the Multi-Attack Feat (listed under Monster Feats in the Bestiary), this is incorrect.
All the Multi-Attack Feat does is reduce the attack penalty for secondary natural weapons from -5 to -2. It does not give you extra attacks or allow you to attack multiple times as a standard action.
Where in the rules is the exact detail on this. (If listing page numbers, please list the print version 1st or 4th, thx.)
You will note I am not using page numbers because I don't have my books to hand. However, look to your left--the long list of links and such. Right under LINKS you will see as the 3rd link down, the link to the PRD, or Pathfinder Reference Document. These are all the most recently errataed rules, sans product identity, from the Core Rulebook, Bestiary, Advanced Player's Guide, and Game Mastery Guide. The PRD is invaluable for cross-referencing rules because much of it is hyperlinked together, which is easier than flipping through two or three books.
Usually a standard action and a move allows 1 attack e.g. 1 bite or 1 claw. In cases of multi-attack that increases.
It doesn't, actually, unless you mean "full attack" when you say multi-attack. A standard action is always* one attack. Even hydras only get one attack as a standard action. On a full attack, the creature gets to attack once with each natural attack they have, unless they're also wielding a weapon with the limb that would attack.
So a Claw/Claw/Bite/Tailslap creature would attack with either a claw, OR a claw, OR a bite, OR a tailslap as a standard action, and would attack with all four as a full attack. If they were holding a sword in one arm, they could get their full iterative attacks with that sword by giving up the one claw attack. If it's a two-handed weapon, they'd need to use both claws.
Rule source for this is based on combining the rules for a standard action attack, a Full round attack, and natural attacks.
But you were able to provide a much more in-depth analysis than I could before leaving for lunch, DeathQuaker.
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Thanks everyone. I'm actually an old hat at the game and understand. I probably was terribly unclear in my question.
I get that a full round action provides attacks with all the possible attacks. I also know that standard actions provide at least one attack.
What I wonder...
There are creatures for which it doesn't make sense for them to attack with 1 claw.
For example: claw claw bite. It just seems that creatures should (at least some should) get claw/claw as a standard. Then Claw/Claw/Bite as a full round action.
I guess as a DM, I'm wondering where in the rules can i find the right feat or what not to get my monsters just one more attack.
For example: Standard action with the xyz feat gives both claws.
Or better yet, I'm asking are we really implying the creatures are attacking with just one claw? Or are we saying this is a one possible hit abstraction whereas the creature really is flailing its arms, but given their use of a move action, the standard action will only account for the possibilty of 1 hit.
Finally , I'm also suggesting a creature with claw/claw/claw/claw/wing/tailslap seems grossly deadly as a full round action, and grieviously limited with just 1 attack on a standard action. Just looking for find rules where I can balance the two out a bit, especially for higher level creatures.
Thanks.
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As far as I am aware there is no way for you to give a creature more than a single attack on a standard action.
As you say it does not thematically make sense for them to attack only once then I must remind you that each round is only 6 seconds and if they are only using the standard action attack then that means they are VERY likely using the other 3ish seconds of the round to do something else, be it move into a better position, draw a weapon, give orders to fellow teammates, grab a potion etc... For things like monsters what can't be imagined to attack with a single claw or what have you, just describe it as the zombie lurching at the PC and raking them with both claws, it doesn't matter what how you describe it as long as (Mechanically) it only really get one attack.
just describe it as the zombie lurching at the PC and raking them with both claws, it doesn't matter what how you describe it as long as (Mechanically) it only really get one attack.
This.
Attacks, like HP, are an abstraction of the combat occurring. Just because a 15th level fighter gets a +15/+10/+5 full attack routine doesn't mean that in the story the fighter is only making three attacks (he could make more) or that he's even making more than one:
Player: I stab the evil king with my longsword through the stomach.
GM: roll your "attacks".
Player: I got a 19, a 12, and a 22.
GM: Two of your "attacks" hit.
Player: I deal 56 damage.
GM: You thrust your sword into the king's belly and slice him open spilling his insides on the floor with one mighty blow.
Attacks, like HP, are an abstraction of the combat occurring.
+1
It's easy to forget how these are abstractions. HP especially. HP aren't just ability to take damage, they're also ability to mitigate/avoid injury. In the example above if the king had 60+ HP could be the attack actually didn't stab him in the belly at all. Could have been a scratch, could have actually missed altogether, but like a cat with 9 lives, it cost him 8 of them.
Thanks everyone. I'm actually an old hat at the game and understand. I probably was terribly unclear in my question.
To be blunt I am not sure how "old hat" you are as this is the way its been since 3.0. Now 1st 2nd ed where a combat round was ONE MINUTE not 6 seconds move and full attack sure.
Pounce effects being the exception moving = lowered damage output.
Finally , I'm also suggesting a creature with claw/claw/claw/claw/wing/tailslap seems grossly deadly as a full round action, and grieviously limited with just 1 attack on a standard action. Just looking for find rules where I can balance the two out a bit, especially for higher level creatures.
There aren't any, aside from high level class abilities which let you get a full attack as a standard action (Mobile Fighter 20, Battle Oracle 20). Dragons are just that scary when making a full attack. Really, this is where reach helps. The creatures with lots of attacks also tend to have reach. So they get right up next to their target, maybe attack once (with cleave, vital strike, a trip or something like that), and then on the target's turn, the target can't get far enough away to get out of reach from the full attack next turn.
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Quick follow up:
A Glabrezu fighting with 2 pincers, 2 claws, and a bite per the Bestiary I stats, each type of attack seperated by a comma, can only use one type of attack if it has moved in a round? Correct?
Now, if it uses an at will spell like ability or other power but does not move, can it make any further attacks?
Quick follow up:
A Glabrezu fighting with 2 pincers, 2 claws, and a bite per the Bestiary I stats, each type of attack seperated by a comma, can only use one type of attack if it has moved in a round? Correct?
Now, if it uses an at will spell like ability or other power but does not move, can it make any further attacks?
SLA's are standard actions so you would not be able to attack, unless the monster had the quicken SLA feat, in which case you could cast the SLA, and still take a full round's worth of actions such as a full attack or move and make on attack.
As to the first paragraph if you move you can only make one attack so that was correct.