Well, it's fairly well implied by the rules that no two wizards scribe their spells the same way, especially in their spell books. It's sort of like looking in your grandma's cookbook and seeing all sorts of little scribbles and notes around the actual recipe. It takes a minute or two to realize that you don't need to add 3 tablespoons of salt, but 3 teaspoons. Well, making a cake is much less complicated that altering reality.
So, sure, you can read all of the words written on the page with the Read Magic spell, but you still have to figure out what they mean.
Buying a scroll is sort of like buying a cookbook in a store. It'll work and you'll end up with a cake in the end, but it won't be Grandma's cake.
If you ask about adding the spell to the spellbook (as it appears from the first paragraph quoted) the process consists of two steps:
1. Deciphering spell. Which may be done with a Spellcraft check (DC 20+spell level) or automatically with read magic spell. This informs you of the spell general construction and effects and allows use of a deciphered scroll. This is not enough to copy it to the spellbook.
2. Understanding the spell. This is deeper analysis achived through studing the formula of the spell. In this part you analyse the spell. Only this level of understanding allows one to "copy" the spell. This is not required if you just want to use scroll instead of addin the spell to your spellbook.
Process known as "copying" spell into own spellbook is actually something more than repeating words in order. Each wizard during training develops his individual way of writing down the spells (sometimes known in fluff as cipher) attuned to own understanding of magic. During the "copying" wizard actually translates formula of the spell he analysed from cipher of another wizard into own.
lest start with scrolls
after using read magic can you cast the spell off the scrolls (not the ones you made the ones you find) or do u stall need to do a spellcraft roll?
If you used read magic on scroll you can complete use it as long as you fulfill any other requirements of the scroll. No further Spellcraft checks are necessary (but caster level check might be required if you are of lower caster level than scroll).
You still would need to make Spellcraft check (DC 15+spell's level) if you wanted to scribe the spell from that scroll into spellbook.
Before it get's asked, I'll ask and answer.
Q : If I can use read magic to cast the spell off the scroll without a check, why do I need to make the check to put it in my spell book!!!!!! Grrr, shake fist!
A : The scroll is intended as a single use spell completion item. The spell is written on the scroll in such a way that once you deciper/read magic it, you can cast the spell on it by completing it. The completion is the easy part. Sort of like boxed macaroni and cheese. Boil, add powder, milk, and butter. Eat. The scroll even has those directions on it.
Just because you can boil and mix, doesn't mean you understand the spell you're casting off the scroll, it just means you have an IQ bigger than a shoe and know how to read the 3 lines of text at the bottom that says 'repeat after me to cast above'.
ok this come up in my game the other day. What’s the point in studying the spell if you can read it? copy and paste to your spell book. if you can read the spell you dont need to study the spell there no point in it.
Reading something isn't the same thing as understanding it.
ok this come up in my game the other day. What’s the point in studying the spell if you can read it? copy and paste to your spell book. if you can read the spell you dont need to study the spell there no point in it.Reading something isn't the same thing as understanding it.
Reminds me of when I picked up a subatomics physics textbook in college.
The words in it were english (i think they were anyway), but I swear I could just about follow the dedication on the inside cover, but after that, things got really wonky.
Reading something isn't the same thing as understanding it.true but now even thro there other language dose that have any thing to do with spells at all
exp elf use elf language to make scroll and a human uses read magic even thro he dont known elf or it dont work that way?
i would right it in my own language wouldnt you?Furthermore, once the spell is cast
and you have read the magical inscription, you are thereafter
able to read that particular writing without recourse to the use
of read magic.
A) To keep mundanes from accidently exploding all my scrolls (I don't want the maid reading my scrolls and accidently casting them while she cleans).
B) Who says magic works when put into elven? Perhaps it requires runes that have power inherent to them.C) If I create a scroll, I can read it any time. I think I might prefer it if a rogue couldn't tell if he was touching my 'Summon Nymph' scroll or my 'Summon Demon Lord' scroll, so I think I'd rather him not be able to easily read either one.
Spells Copied from Another’s Spellbook or a Scroll pg 219
No matter what the spell’s source,
the wizard must first decipher the magical writing (see
Arcane Magical Writings). Next, he must spend 1 hour
studying the spell. At the end of the hour, he must make
a Spellcraft check (DC 15 + spell’s level).
Arcane Magical Writings pg 218-219
pg:219 To decipher an arcane magical writing (such as a single
spell in another’s spellbook or on a scroll), a character
must make a Spellcraft check (DC 20 + the spell’s level).
For the first time I noticed two different DC's here.
From what I understand you need to make a DC 20+ spell level check to decipher the writing, or cast read magic. The next thing is to make DC 15+spell level check to copy it into the book.
I can't believe I have been doing it wrong, and teaching others how to do it wrong all this time.
Well, it's fairly well implied by the rules that no two wizards scribe their spells the same way, especially in their spell books. It's sort of like looking in your grandma's cookbook and seeing all sorts of little scribbles and notes around the actual recipe. It takes a minute or two to realize that you don't need to add 3 tablespoons of salt, but 3 teaspoons. Well, making a cake is much less complicated that altering reality.
So, sure, you can read all of the words written on the page with the Read Magic spell, but you still have to figure out what they mean.
Buying a scroll is sort of like buying a cookbook in a store. It'll work and you'll end up with a cake in the end, but it won't be Grandma's cake.
ok for a spell book that fine i get that but "You can read at the rate of one page (250 words) per minute." 1 spell per page" so how much time it will take to read a spell book?
do you have to studying each spell in the spell book he must spend 1 hour studying the spell. At the end of the hour, he must make
a Spellcraft check (DC 15 + spell’s level). it will take days to do a full spellbookor can you doing in one shot?
Each spell in a spellbook must be done done individually.
You have to decipher and then study the spell.Repeat the process for the next spell. 3.5 had a rule that allowed you to do it with one high check in the Complete Arcane book. If you are not the DM you can ask your DM if he will allow that to speed things up.
I can read the ingredients on the package of my Twinkie snack pack... that does not mean I know how to make one or have a clue what is in it.
Reading and Understanding are not always the same thing.