Ok,
I'm in a unique position for me. :) I'm actually playing in a PF game (instead of running).
The party was :
Warforged Fighter
Warforged Artificer (converted to PF, GMs husband)
Elf Druid (My wife)
Rogue/Warlock (My character).
I started off as a Scout character at 1st level, we all did. I converted to Rogue when we switched to PF at 2nd level. At first level, we had issues with appraising things, etc due to plot setup (nobody had local knowledge to start with, magic happened and we were in a new place).
When I hit second level, I went to Warlock, as we needed some arcane ability. So, I planned on doing Rogue/Warlock as basically 2/3rds rogue, 1/3rd warlock. Unfortunately, the Artificer and me seem to be going the same route as far as disable device/lockpicking/etc. That didn't seem a big deal, since eventually as a rogue, even multiclassed, I'd have to be the one dealing with traps, when we hit magic ones. So I started pushing towards being 'the face' of the group, as a human I have the best overall ability to talk to multiple peoples.
However, we've had a new addition to the game. THe Artificer's nephew joined the game, and the Artificer made him a level 2 rogue specialized in stealth & traps and also with flashy personality and diplomacy etc.
So now I'm not really sure what to do with my character. The new rogue is going to be better than me at rogue stuff (I can't be as good as a non-multiclassed). I don't really want to get into a competition over being the team face. I'm actually not all that concerned with it. I can take it or leave it.
I'm actually now with a character that doesn't have any skills that can't be covered by other people, can't be as good at it as they are, other than blasting things. I'm not opposed to being the team blaster, but if I'd thought that would be my role, I would have went sorcerer or maybe Oracle. Right now I'm set up to be a skill monkey (18 int) with two other skill monkeys in the group (artificer with 16 int and rogue with 16 int). I'm a so so blaster (14 dex, 16 cha), and I'm set up to be decent at dealing out some damage with the eldritch blast, but that won't last long as it doesn't scale very well at higher levels.
Basically, I'm just not sure what to do with the character. I'm honestly considering asking the GM to 'retire' the character to NPC status to hold down the fort for the other players in our home base, and build a new character to take out on adventures. But I thought I'd see what advice I could get first.
Your only option (as I see it), other than the one you mentioned, would be to go arcane trickster. This can be pretty powerful with warlock if you sneak attack with your eldritch blasts. With your good number of skill points you could be the arcane identifier and wielder of wands.
However, as with many prestige classes, prepare to suck for 4 more levels and then some before any glory rolls your way.
I think it is easier to just bring in a new character. If you keep changing your character every time something happens I think you will end with a character that can't do a whole lot though. If you don't really care about what you play in the game let the others have your spots, and bring in something you want to play, that way everyone is happy. Changing things out at low levels bring less disruption to the game than it would later in the game.
Are you having fun playing your character or feel an attachment to him? If not talk to your GM and make a new character that you want to play.
Maybe Human Ulfen (if you are in the Golarion setting) Monk/Barbarian. That has a fighting style that Imitates a bare or something. Just make a new character if your not having fun with him.
I really like the character. Not too worried about the place in the group or abilities, I usually get into the character more than the build. I just don't like feeling useless either.
Not in ebberon, just two people playing warforged who got yoinked out of ebberon.
I don't think I can go arcane trickster with Warlock/Rogue. I thought I looked into it adn there was something that stopped it from working. but again, I'd be back to doing nothing useful for lots of levels.
EDIT:
yeah, can't do arcane trickster
Spells: Ability to cast mage hand and at least one arcane spell of 2nd level or higher.
I really like the character. Not too worried about the place in the group or abilities, I usually get into the character more than the build. I just don't like feeling useless either.
Not in ebberon, just two people playing warforged who got yoinked out of ebberon.
I don't think I can go arcane trickster with Warlock/Rogue. I thought I looked into it adn there was something that stopped it from working. but again, I'd be back to doing nothing useful for lots of levels.
Yeah you can't qualify due to:
Spells: Ability to cast mage hand and at least one arcane spell of 2nd level or higher.I think everyone should have discussed their duties prior to making characters. While just showing up with whatever you want is more organic I don't think it should be done unless the DM is going to adjust to the party. If the party has to adjust, planning before building is the better way to do it.
In any event I still think you should make a new character. I am sure there is another concept you have not gotten to play yet. :)
I think everyone should have discussed their duties prior to making characters. While just showing up with whatever you want is more organic I don't think it should be done unless the DM is going to adjust to the party. If the party has to adjust, planning before building is the better way to do it.
In any event I still think you should make a new character. I am sure there is another concept you have not gotten to play yet. :)
It was sort of a last minute thing originally, and we've lost 2 players since the first game. So sort of chaotic.
yeah, I think what I'm going to have to do is take the GM aside and tell her after the current story arc is done (we're on a big treasure hunt), that I want to 'retire' him to NPC status and create a new PC so I'm not duplicating everyone else's abilities.
Maybe a sorcerer or witch. I'd do a summoner, but I hate the core summoner as it is.
And yeah, tons of concepts.
You could ask for a retrain of your skills (and or feats) and invest those points in skills the party has not.
Use rope for example:
I am not that familiar with the warlock class, but I am sure he has some kind of telekinesis-like ability. Combine that with a high use rope skill and quickly tie your enemies up during battle ^^
Also it does not hurt to have two charismatic persons in the party. You can each specialize in certain people to talk to.
For example the more civilized looking one represents the party with nobility, official institutions and such. The more brutal and devious looking represents the party when meeting a thieves guild, a savage orc tribe or the like.
Also you can talk unnoticed with each other using Bluff ;3
And there is even the Aid Another option for the extra difficult diplomatic situations.
And sometimes you simply need to talk with people at two places at the same time.
You could ask for a retrain of your skills (and or feats) and invest those points in skills the party has not.
Use rope for example:
I am not that familiar with the warlock class, but I am sure he has some kind of telekinesis-like ability. Combine that with a high use rope skill and quickly tie your enemies up during battle ^^Also it does not hurt to have two charismatic persons in the party. You can each specialize in certain people to talk to.
For example the more civilized looking one represents the party with nobility, official institutions and such. The more brutal and devious looking represents the party when meeting a thieves guild, a savage orc tribe or the like.
Also you can talk unnoticed with each other using Bluff ;3
And there is even the Aid Another option for the extra difficult diplomatic situations.
And sometimes you simply need to talk with people at two places at the same time.
I don't mind duplicating one person in the party. :) But we're up to 3 skill monkeys doing the same things. :) At that point, it becomes a bit redundant unless you're working on an all-skill monkey campaign.
No telekinesis, and no use rope in PF. :)
Specializing in talking to different types is possible, unfortunately, we're both geared up towards the diplomatic type, not the intimidating type (neither character is very intimidating physicall, one's a halfling and the other is a human with str 10).
I've been 'aiding another' for a couple of games now to avoid stepping on anyone's toes with rogue abilities, and that was before the new rogue got added in. :)
Ah sorry. Playing both 3.5 and PF and get confused sometimes ^^
I had the impression that only one of the two other skill monkeys was going the charismatic route.
But if that is the case then it really does make for a lot of redundancy. I guess you have to decide which is more fun (which you aparently did already)
OK,
So, have decided to retire my current character and make a new one, to avoid waves.
Current party is, as stated above :
Halfling Rogue
Warforged Fighter
Elf Druid
Warforged Artificer
I'm thinking we need an Arcane person, preferrably someone who can double as a face. I'm leaning towards one of these...
Wizard (with Cha)
Witch (with Cha)
Sorcerer
All 3 give arcane spells. The witch is the weakest caster, but has hexes. The wizard has the most versatility, but contributes to MAD if I want to be able to back up as the face character. Sorcerer is sort of middle ground and cuts down on MAD.
Magus is also a possibility, if the UM is out before the end of our current quest.
I'm also leaning toward one of the elemental humans from B2. Maybe. But I'm open. Any suggestions? I'm used to making characters as bad guys, and that takes a whole different mindset than making characters.
The stormborn sorcerer archetype seems pretty cool. My 2nd choice would be the witch.
The stormborn sorcerer archetype seems pretty cool. My 2nd choice would be the witch.
It does seem pretty good, only one I've seen with both sonic and shock resistance.
I was actually leaning toward Oread (sp?) and elemental (earth) bloodline sorcerer, but the Oread's actually penalize themselves as a sorcerer. Granted, they get a boost back, but it's an overall wash. I really like that combination though.
Hmm,
Ok, leaning toward one of the following :
Oread Earth Sorcerer
Elf Stormborn Sorcerer
The oread stormborn would get resistance to 3 elements, but have a penalty to charisma, which sucks.
Either way, I want to give the sorcerer a bow, and have him use that as a backup when he's out of spells. For the Oread, that would be problematic. We're using weapon groups in our game (you get 1, 2, or 4 weapon groups based on BAB, as per weapon groups in fighter specs). So I could get one weapon group for the sorcerer that was bows no matter what. Elf has the advantage that he's already got bows, and can take swords (and thus his 'treat elven as martial' kicks in and elven curve blades come into play).
The oread has the advantage of being a decent sorcerer despite cha penalty (due to treating cha as 2 higher for elemental), has acid resistance (which, being racial, I believe stacks with the 10 from the bloodline), and can hold his own in melee if forced into it.
I'm thinking first and third level feats are Arcane Armor Training and Point Blank Shot (heading towards precise shot at 5) either way, if I'm wanting to be able to wear armor and still cast when needed. Light armor only obviously. Probably elven chain or mithral shirt.
Hmm,
Ok, leaning toward one of the following :Oread Earth Sorcerer
Elf Stormborn Sorcerer
The oread stormborn would get resistance to 3 elements, but have a penalty to charisma, which sucks.
Either way, I want to give the sorcerer a bow, and have him use that as a backup when he's out of spells. For the Oread, that would be problematic. We're using weapon groups in our game (you get 1, 2, or 4 weapon groups based on BAB, as per weapon groups in fighter specs). So I could get one weapon group for the sorcerer that was bows no matter what. Elf has the advantage that he's already got bows, and can take swords (and thus his 'treat elven as martial' kicks in and elven curve blades come into play).
The oread has the advantage of being a decent sorcerer despite cha penalty (due to treating cha as 2 higher for elemental), has acid resistance (which, being racial, I believe stacks with the 10 from the bloodline), and can hold his own in melee if forced into it.
I'm thinking first and third level feats are Arcane Armor Training and Point Blank Shot (heading towards precise shot at 5) either way, if I'm wanting to be able to wear armor and still cast when needed. Light armor only obviously. Probably elven chain or mithral shirt.
Energy resistance is like DR in the sense that it does not stack, but only overlaps. I am sure I read that somewhere, but I can't recall the source right now.
The Oread is treated as if his charisma being 2 level highers for all sorcerer spells, not just elemental ones so you only eat the -2 on social checks and UMD
Oread sorcerers with the Elemental (earth) bloodline treat their Charisma score as 2 points higher for all sorcerer spells and class abilities.
Energy resistance is like DR in the sense that it does not stack, but only overlaps. I am sure I read that somewhere, but I can't recall the source right now.The Oread is treated as if his charisma being 2 level highers for all sorcerer spells, not just elemental ones so you only eat the -2 on social checks and UMD
Oread sorcerers with the Elemental (earth) bloodline treat their Charisma score as 2 points higher for all sorcerer spells and class abilities.
Yep, I knew about the UMD and skills, wasn't all that worried about it. Honestly, for UMD and skills, a +1 isn't that painful. It's the spells and abilities that it would hurt on.
I can't either. I sort of thought they didn't stack, although that kind of goes back against the oread being a good elemental sorcerer. If it didn't effect the abilities and such, I'd go stormborn oread, as they really do mesh very well other than the cha penalty.
If I wanted to game play it, I could do an Ifrit fire elemental sorcerer, which would really boost the abilities, on the other hand, most damage spells are fire anyway. Plus I don't like playing characters with horns. :)
One character I'm interested in is a half-orc sorcerer (draconic) focusing on fire spells (using the half-orc favored class bonus). I like that this build can be a pretty decent face with high intimidate *and* deal a lot of fire damage. It's not a "nice guy" diplomatic character though. . .
One character I'm interested in is a half-orc sorcerer (draconic) focusing on fire spells (using the half-orc favored class bonus). I like that this build can be a pretty decent face with high intimidate *and* deal a lot of fire damage. It's not a "nice guy" diplomatic character though. . .
No need it should have to be. Batman has a lot of CHA, but he channels it into being feared, not liked.
One character I'm interested in is a half-orc sorcerer (draconic) focusing on fire spells (using the half-orc favored class bonus). I like that this build can be a pretty decent face with high intimidate *and* deal a lot of fire damage. It's not a "nice guy" diplomatic character though. . .No need it should have to be. Batman has a lot of CHA, but he channels it into being feared, not liked.
Don't forget about Bruce Wayne...
Also, you could convert your rogue/warlock into an inquisitor. Take the fire domain to replace your "eldrich blast. You also get a nice skill selection, good melee, a kind of "sneak attack" with judgement of justice. Could work pretty well and would let you cast divine spells, a thing your character only will do.
One character I'm interested in is a half-orc sorcerer (draconic) focusing on fire spells (using the half-orc favored class bonus). I like that this build can be a pretty decent face with high intimidate *and* deal a lot of fire damage. It's not a "nice guy" diplomatic character though. . .No need it should have to be. Batman has a lot of CHA, but he channels it into being feared, not liked.Don't forget about Bruce Wayne...
Also, you could convert your rogue/warlock into an inquisitor. Take the fire domain to replace your "eldrich blast. You also get a nice skill selection, good melee, a kind of "sneak attack" with judgement of justice. Could work pretty well and would let you cast divine spells, a thing your character only will do.
Bruce, classically, was not the best of diplomats. That was by design. He did have a lot of experience with the ladies, but being a diplomat in the business world or elsewhere he didn't do very well.
On the conversion, I hate converting characters. It severely breaks my immersion. Severely.
Wizard (with Cha)Does the artificer have a decent number of knowledge skills?
Let's look at this build for 15pts:
STR 07 (-4pts)
INT 20 (17pts)
WIS 07 (-4pts)
DEX 12 (2pts)
CON 12 (2pts)
CHA 12 (2pts)This would be any race that gives +2 INT. Bumps to INT of course.
The build would have 7skill ranks/level before INT boosters or bumps, and before favored class bonus. It should be enough to deliver a good number of niches that your party could use.
While the CON isn't all that high, it's no worse than a 14CON wizard back in 3e. And again the favored class bonus could go to hps rather than skills.
-James
Yeah, he's got good int and skills. We don't do point buy, we do 4d6 drop lowest, but if we did, I would never do 2 sevens for stats. I don't like to go below 8 at most when doing point buy, and usually no more than 1 stat.
I've never enjoyed playing wizards is the problem. I know they're more versatile, but I just never enjoyed it much.
Ok,
The more I think of it, the more I'm leaning towards this :
Monk 1/Sorcerer 2
Either
Human Zen Archer 1/Storm Born Sorcerer 2
or
Oread Zen Archer 1/Earth Elemental Sorcerer 2
I was wanting to be a sorcerer who could use bows in the background when not casting or when out of spells. The dip into Zen Archer get's me a couple of bonuses.
Good save boost across the board.
Proficiency with bows.
Flurry with Bows (not so good, but it's there)
Wisdom bonus to AC
Perfect Strike
Improved Unarmed Strike
Bonus Feat at 1st level
It costs me one level of Sorcerer, but gives me quite a few boosts, especially if I can get my wisdom up.
Using this setup, I'd have 3 feats (4 if human) at 3rd level.
Point-Blank Shot
Precise Shot
Not sure what to take for 3rd feat (or 4th if human)
Dodge (Dodge & Mobility?)?
Ok,
Working on two builds, not sure which I'll use. Here's the Oread Zen Archer/Earth Sorcerer
We roll stats, and I rolled 10, 13, 15, 15, 15, 17 (Good day on the rolls).
Str : 15 (13 + 2)
Dex : 15
Con : 15
Int : 10
Wis : 17 (15 + 2)
Cha : 15 (17 - 2)
HPs : 21
Saves : Fort(4), Reflex(4), Will(8)
Traits : Focused Mind & Log Roller (See fluff)
Feats : Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Perfect Strike (1/day w bows), Eschew Materials, Dodge
Darkvision 60ft, Acid Resist (5), Magic Stone 1/day (CL 3)
Flurry of Arrows, Unarmed Strike (1d6)
Acidic Ray (30 ft, 1d6+1, RTA, 6/day)
Skills
Acrobatics 9
Kn Arcana : 4
Kn Planes : 4
Kn Religion : 4
Perception : 7
Spellcraft : 4
Stealth : 6
UMD : 6
MW Composite (+2) Longbow, MW Kukri, Ring of Protection +1
AC : 17, Touch 17, Flat Foot 14
w Mage Armor or Shield : 21/21/18
w Mage Armor & Shield : 25/25/22
Spells per day : Cantrip(5), First(4)
Spells Known : Detect Magic, Read magic, Ray of Frost, Disrupt Undead, Prestidigitation, Mage Armor, Shield
Fluff
Darin was born to a rural family. The son of a teenage daughter who refused to speak about who the father was. When he was born, the girls parents were horrified to see the baby had gray skin. Being good, they could not kill it, but they also couldn't stomach it either. So they left it in a basket at the monastery in the hills, with a small bag of coins and a note asking the monks to care for the baby.
Darin's early years were spent training with the monks, learning to meditate (Focused Mind). He was schooled both mentally and physically, including exercises involving balance atop poles (Log Roller trait) to keep his balance. The monks found he had a natural affinity for the bow, and he was taught the ways of Zen.
However, the earth called to him all the time, and when he reached puberty, he began to manifest powers that the monks didn't know how to train or deal with. Finally, unable to suppress his burgeoning natural talents, and unable to continue training with the monks and still use his new talents, Darin set off on the road by himself to learn what he could of himself.
The road is a dangerous mistress, especially for those who are different, and he found quickly that his new talents worked best when he used them for defense, combining his new talents with those the monks taught him. Making up for lack of defenses by using his magic, and using his martial training from the monks for offense.
------------------------------------
As I'm kind of looking at it, I think he'll be going 3 levels sorcerer per level of monk. At 20th, he'd be a 15th level sorcerer, 5th level monk. Down the road, obviously, I want a monk's robe for him, as well as bracers of armor or bracers of archery (haven't decided yet). I think the Mage Armor can handle defense for quite a while, so maybe bracers of archery and skip the BoA. Magical bows of course. At low levels, his martial abilities are going to outstrip his magic, and at higher levels, his martial abilities will be a nice 'fall back' if he runs out of spells. Overall, I think there's a good symmetry there between monk and sorcerer. Thoughts anyone? Things I missed or could have done better? Please don't spout out 'Don't do monk', if I just wanted a 'shout down the monk' thread, I would have started it off as 'Please let's run down the monk'. :)