I've been looking at thrown weapon rogue builds, and trying to decide what weapon would be best. Ideally, it would have a range increment of 30 ft or longer, since 30' is the range limit on sneak attack, making 30' the perfect distance from the enemy.
Here are the only thrown weapons with range of 30' or longer, and I have a question about each one:
- Javelin - Simple, but difficult to use in melee. This was the weapon that came to mind when my friend started to make a "Dagger Throwing Rogue". I believe the difficulty using it in melee could be alleviated with the feat Catch Off-Guard, but I'd like to have that confirmed before we build a character.
- Chakram - Martial, also difficult to use in melee. Is there anything that into a decent melee weapon?
- Boomerang - Exotic, but I believe you can use it in melee as easily as at range. Is that correct?
There is nothing in the boomerang's description in the PRD that suggests it can be used in melee, and it is solely listed as a ranged weapon. I therefore would assume using it as a melee weapon would incur a penalty. Since it doesn't have the returning property, I'm actually curious as to why it is an exotic weapon, come to think of it. Maybe it is supposed to be usable as a club, but there's no clear text I can find to say so.
Wit the items you list, I would go for the chakram, which is only a -1 penalty to use in melee (with a Reflex save easy for a Rogue to make) and has the best damage.
Alternately, I would consider using a starknife. I know that only has 20' range, but you could take Far Shot to mitigate throwing it past the first range increment, and/or eventually work toward getting a starknife of distance.
As for Catch Off Guard allowing javelins or boomerangs to ignore the penalty... that will have to be up to your GM. RAW says using javelins as a melee weapon is done "non-proficiently"--not actually as an improvised weapon.
Logically, the boomerang would probably be the most difficult of those to use in melee.
Take the boomerang for the fact that it is NOT a melee weapon.
With the Catch Off-Guard feat, improvised melee weapons can be a choice weapon for rogues, as their enemies are flat-footed against their attacks, so you don't have to worry about flanking for sneak attacks.
There is nothing in the boomerang's description in the PRD that suggests it can be used in melee, and it is solely listed as a ranged weapon. I therefore would assume using it as a melee weapon would incur a penalty. Since it doesn't have the returning property, I'm actually curious as to why it is an exotic weapon, come to think of it. Maybe it is supposed to be usable as a club, but there's no clear text I can find to say so.
That was my impression too. But many throwing weapons, javelin and chakram for example, describe what happens when you use them in melee. Also, a real world boomerang made for hunting or fighting is both a throwing and melee weapon - essentially a club improved for throwing. The Pathfinder boomerang has exactly the stats of a club, including weight, with the sole exception of 30' range rather than 10' range.
With the items you list, I would go for the chakram, which is only a -1 penalty to use in melee (with a Reflex save easy for a Rogue to make) and has the best damage.
It certainly has some advantages. The biggest disadvantage is that I'd really get sick of rolling a save with every attack roll.
Alternately, I would consider using a starknife. I know that only has 20' range, but you could take Far Shot to mitigate throwing it past the first range increment, and/or eventually work toward getting a starknife of distance.
20' range isn't terrible, not great, but not terrible. It would mean standing at 20' rather than 30' often.
As for Catch Off Guard allowing javelins or boomerangs to ignore the penalty... that will have to be up to your GM. RAW says using javelins as a melee weapon is done "non-proficiently"--not actually as an improvised weapon.
”Non-proficiently” is an odd term. It implies that you may, in fact, become proficient with a melee javelin somehow. And, really, how difficult could it be to stab someone with a pointed stick? Is a javelin somehow that much harder to stab with than a shortspear?
Logically, the boomerang would probably be the most difficult of those to use in melee.
I think a chackram would be much more difficult to wield in melee, having blades all around. A hunting boomerang is simply a club.
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Alternately, I would consider using a starknife. I know that only has 20' range, but you could take Far Shot to mitigate throwing it past the first range increment, and/or eventually work toward getting a starknife of distance.20' range isn't terrible, not great, but not terrible. It would mean standing at 20' rather than 30' often.
Or standing at 30' and taking a -2 to hit (-1 with Far Shot).
”Non-proficiently” is an odd term. It implies that you may, in fact, become proficient with a melee javelin somehow. And, really, how difficult could it be to stab someone with a pointed stick? Is a javelin somehow that much harder to stab with than a shortspear?
I am not a weapons expert, but I imagine the way a javelin is balanced would make it a little more unwieldy than a spear as a melee weapon.
That said, I've thought about houseruling in bonus proficiency-steps for certain weapons. You know how if you have martial proficiency, you can use a bastard sword, but you need exotic proficiency to use it one-handed without penalty? That kind of thing, applied to other weapons. So maybe if you have martial proficiency in javelin, you could use it as a melee weapon without penalty.
As for boomerang as club, having held a boomerang once in my life, I think it would feel weird to try to hit someone with it in melee, again, because of balance. But I, again, am not an expert.
hunting or war boomerangs are basically flying clubs usingnone in melee shouldn't be hard. I would use club bit. penalty because of shape -2 maybe.