Artificer - Let's play 20 questions!


Rules Questions


Need help with the Artificer Class (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/3rd-party-classes/artificer)...

1. Does the class have a key attribute?
2. Is their casting tied to any specific stat?
3. Looking at their BAB progression, they look to be more of a melee class, but then they are only a D6 hit dice class, which suggests caster. Which niche are they?
4. Is the multiple spell effects from one trigger completely overpowered?
5. Crafting rolls are confusing, when I am making things do I just use spellcraft to enchant magical items? or do I need 25 craft skills?
6. Not sure I have ever seen a class with an odd number of skills per level (5 + Int). Is this a sign that this class was thrown together by drunk monkeys?
7. Weird science appears to cost nothing, and require no rolls, is that correct?
8. At level 20 if I roll an untrained skill I get a +13 to roll, but if I put a single point into it I lose +9 to my roll? Do I understand Exemplar correctly?
9. How do Weird Science cantrips/orizons work? Can I make two for everyone level 1 weird science build I have at my disposal?
10. What are the DCs to resist the spells coming out of the weird science devices?
11. I cannot believe this, but there are no components required for their weird science devices. Can an artificer throw out costless stoneskin spells?
12. I see no mention of a spellbook, or spells known, do they just know all arcane spells up to level 4 innately?
13. Is it a standard action that incurs an AoO when someone triggers one of the Artificer's devices?
14. Example 3, under "Item Creation" speaks of making a fireball item at level 3. If I understand the bonus item creation feats, then the only items you could make would be scrolls, or potions at that level. Am I reading that right?
15. How much does a weird science item weigh? Are there size restrictions to weird science items?
16. If I launch multiple damaging spells with one trigger pull, do they have individual saves - or is it treated as one spell?
17. Can I put the same spell on a device more than once?
18. While weird science has a restriction of level 4 spells, does item creation have a maximum ceiling for levels?
19. I am confused by the bonus metamagic feats. I have to take a metamagic feat, but where can I apply it? Can weird science have metamagic applied? If so, how does it affect the item?
20. How many of you are playing this class right out of the box with no modifications?


Xenh wrote:
8. At level 20 if I roll an untrained skill I get a +13 to roll, but if I put a single point into it I lose +9 to my roll? Do I understand Exemplar correctly?

Oops, my math is off.

I was giving myself the +10 for Exemplar and the +3 for a trained skill, but both do not apply at the same time.

So it would a loss of +6 on my roll rather.


Practically every question you asked is answered in the text describing the class abilities... this is sarcasm fyi.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Also, the Artificer isn't an official class, so don't expect devs to chime in on this.

Which reminds, d20pfsrd could really do without those wonky ToS classes :/


I haven't dealt at all with crafting as a PC or GM, so I can't really give you any first-hand advice. All I can really suggest is that you invest highly in INT and CHA, particularly because the class is heavily built around the Craft and Use Magic Device skills, which rely on those abilities respectively. I would probably put more into INT; it really seems like the class is meant to be a skill-monkey to an extent.

Dark Archive

Use the original class with these modifications HERE. It's way more balanced (in spite of the fact that it is still an unbalanced class).

The Tome of Secrets one is completely screwy. Why 5+Int skill points? Why not 4 or 6? Medium BAB with d6? These are just some of the inconsistencies that don't follow the class building guidelines lain down by the Core Rulebook.

The biggest problem with the class is Weird Science. With 48 hours of work a 5th level Artificer can create an item that fires off four 5d6 Fireballs for 20d6 damage. The only limitation is time meaning there's nothing to stop a player from creating a game breaking device but the time that passes between adventures.

Grand Lodge

coff wrote:


The biggest problem with the class is Weird Science. With 48 hours of work a 5th level Artificer can create an item that fires off four 5d6 Fireballs for 20d6 damage. The only limitation is time meaning there's nothing to stop a player from creating a game breaking device but the time that passes between adventures.

No he can't. a 5th level Artificer can have a total of one 3rd level effect device available in a ready device. So that's just one fireball... of 5d6. He can use it 4 times a day, but not 4 times at once.

The Exchange

Gorbacz wrote:
Which reminds, d20pfsrd could really do without those wonky ToS classes :/

Not the first time I've heard that lol

In general we try not to make too many judgment calls on stuff. If its OGC and its created for Pathfinder, it can find a home on the site. I will readily admit though that I have considered, on numerous times, removing the Artificer because of its many issues.

The Exchange

coff wrote:

Use the original class with these modifications HERE. It's way more balanced (in spite of the fact that it is still an unbalanced class).

The Tome of Secrets one is completely screwy. Why 5+Int skill points? Why not 4 or 6? Medium BAB with d6? These are just some of the inconsistencies that don't follow the class building guidelines lain down by the Core Rulebook.

The biggest problem with the class is Weird Science. With 48 hours of work a 5th level Artificer can create an item that fires off four 5d6 Fireballs for 20d6 damage. The only limitation is time meaning there's nothing to stop a player from creating a game breaking device but the time that passes between adventures.

That's what happens when the publisher releases the book on the same day as the Core Rulebook was released.

The best fix of it that I have found is this one (plus giving a d8 HD): http://www.mediafire.com/?i50z0n5dbwm

Dark Archive

LazarX wrote:
coff wrote:


The biggest problem with the class is Weird Science. With 48 hours of work a 5th level Artificer can create an item that fires off four 5d6 Fireballs for 20d6 damage. The only limitation is time meaning there's nothing to stop a player from creating a game breaking device but the time that passes between adventures.

No he can't. a 5th level Artificer can have a total of one 3rd level effect device available in a ready device. So that's just one fireball... of 5d6. He can use it 4 times a day, but not 4 times at once.

Ah, I see where you're getting that now. I was just reading the text on the ability not the table. The ability is slightly less overpowered than I thought...

But I still think it's overpowered. Lightning Bolt + Flaming Sphere + three 5th level Magic Missiles = 5d6 + 3d6+ 9d4+9 damage, ranging 29-93 damage per turn for 4 turns @ 5th level.


I would like to chime in on this ( 5 months after the last post)
I am starting anew champain and want to make an artificer and my GM read to ToS poorly defined section and had almost all of the same 20 questions
I would love to see someone talented enough to answer all of them clearly
The biggest question is about adding metamagic feats to the weird science devices
One search came up with NO
Another said YES but only one
And another said a metamagic feat can be added on the fly but will risk the break DC roll mechanic
Just for fun i came up with same lvl 5 machine mentioned above
And at level 6 added metamagic feat of maximize and you get he 93 damage every time
4 x a day
Now the lvl 20 can use Ball Lightming with cl 20 is 5 ball each doing 3d6 x 5 of the spell
For 75d6 and they last for several rounds ( 11 or 20 i can not remeber now) but they only move at 20 feet per round and a reflex save negates all damage
So add metamagic persistant spell and they have to survive 150 saving throws, bound to be a lot natural 1's in there.
Only thing suriviving is electric immunity or auto relfex save or some other spell i am not aware of
Now that is single target damage
But those 150 balls can be split up?
And spread aroumd
Oh and next round there are 150 more x 11 (1650 balls x d6 each lasting 20 rounds)
Anyone doing the math?
Now the wizard can counjur and army of angels or demons
And dinosours etc etc and augment them amd more
So lvl 20 is crazy broken on both sides of the fence
Anyway if anyone has those 20 answers
Thanks
Sure at lvl 20 the wizard will also have an army of


ok I did the math, if all reflex save fail then 198,000 dmage over 31 levels, by the Ball lightning gun alone

I uassume the other 3 levels of spells would be used to make guns for buffs, heals, etc

He still would be the ultimate glass cannon

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