Can you use Drunken Ki for standard monk ki powers?

[Mr. Horyd]

I'm very keen to run a Drunken Master in the Pathfinder game my buddies and I are running, but in the last session doubts were raised as to whether or not drunken ki points could be used for the monk's normal ki powers (extra flurry attack, Wholeness of Body, Abundant Step, etc.) While several of the Drunken Master's abilities specifically require "drunken ki", such as Drunken Strength, there's no mention about whether or not drunken ki can be used in place of normal ki.

Is there a ruling somewhere that can clarify this?

[Mr. Horyd]

Perhaps an opinion on intent, whether drunken ki is supposed to be a means of having a slightly larger and slightly renewable ki pool in general, or a seperate pool designed only to allow a few new abilities?

[thepuregamer]

Mr. Horyd wrote:

Perhaps an opinion on intent, whether drunken ki is supposed to be a means of having a slightly larger and slightly renewable ki pool in general, or a seperate pool designed only to allow a few new abilities?

As far as I can tell, you definitely can.

"a drunken master can drink a tankard of ale or strong alcohol and gain one temporary ki point"

So it is just a regular point of ki. They refer to it as drunken ki points when they are telling you how many you can store at once, and some of the drunken master's abilities require drunken ki points to use. But he still gains his regular ki pool abilities and the drunken ki is still refered to as a temporary ki point. There are no specified restrictions on using the drunken ki, so as far as I can tell, it is fair play.

[Mr. Horyd]

Yes, but there's no specified allowance for using drunken ki on normal ki powers either. There's worry that allowing a monk to essentially indefinitely use abilities like going ethereal and dimension door, or chugging a few silver worth of booze instead of several hundred gold worth of potions and wand charges to heal fully between combats is too powerful.

[Shadow_of_death]

Mr. Horyd wrote:

Yes, but there's no specified allowance for using drunken ki on normal ki powers either. There's worry that allowing a monk to use abilities like going ethereal, dimension dooring, or chugging a few silver worth of booze instead of several hundred gold worth of potions and wand charges to heal fully between combats is too powerful.

There's worry about something the monk does is powerful.... there may be hope yet

[kyrt-ryder]

Shadow_of_death wrote:

Mr. Horyd wrote:

Yes, but there's no specified allowance for using drunken ki on normal ki powers either. There's worry that allowing a monk to use abilities like going ethereal, dimension dooring, or chugging a few silver worth of booze instead of several hundred gold worth of potions and wand charges to heal fully between combats is too powerful.

There's worry about something the monk does is powerful.... there may be hope yet

+1

[thepuregamer]

Mr. Horyd wrote:

Yes, but there's no specified allowance for using drunken ki on normal ki powers either. There's worry that allowing a monk to use abilities like going ethereal, dimension dooring, or chugging a few silver worth of booze instead of several hundred gold worth of potions and wand charges to heal fully between combats is too powerful.

Well, if you don't allow it, the drunken master is going to be pitiful. Using ki to get an extra 5 ft step,incease damage on a single attack, gain immunity to fear in a high will save class, get crapp dr, or breath fire is pretty weak. None of those abilities are all that great. Atleast if you let him use his wasted ki on regular abilities he can consistently get an extra attack a round without running out in 1 or 2 encounters.

So yeah, as far as I am concerned, you might as well scrap the drunken master variant if he can't use that ki on the other powers.

[Mr. Horyd]

Errata's out, and still we don't have direct confirmation of whether or not ki and drunken ki are interchangable.

Any change a Paizo contributor could offer an official stance?

[Mr. Horyd]

Still hoping for a simple answer here.

[Andrew Besso]

One thing I have not seen anywhere in the rules is the effect of excessive alcohol. It seems to me that a character should gain the "confused" condition after a certain number of drinks in a short time. Perhaps the character should become paralyzed or unconscious at some point. A Drunken Master could drink considerably more than other characters, but would still risk gaining those conditions eventually.

Is there any mention of drunkenness in RAW that I just missed?

[Shadow_of_death]

Andrew Besso wrote:

One thing I have not seen anywhere in the rules is the effect of excessive alcohol. It seems to me that a character should gain the "confused" condition after a certain number of drinks in a short time. Perhaps the character should become paralyzed or unconscious at some point. A Drunken Master could drink considerably more than other characters, but would still risk gaining those conditions eventually.

Is there any mention of drunkenness in RAW that I just missed?

There are rules, I believe they are in the same section as poisons

[King of Vrock]

Actually Drunkeness is in the GMG and now on the PRD under Drugs and Addiction.

PRD wrote:

Just like drugs, alcohol can be abused and have significant negative effects. In general, a character can consume a number of alcoholic beverages equal to 1 plus double his Constitution modifier before being sickened for 1 hour equal to the number of drinks above this maximum. Particularly exotic or strong forms of alcohol might be treated as normal drugs. Those who regularly abuse alcohol might eventually develop a moderate addiction.

--Give me a Wild Pazuzu bourbon on the Vrocks!

[Zurai]

Generally speaking, an <adjective> <noun> is still a <noun>. A golden toilet is still a toilet; a drunken sailor is still a sailor; a magical cat is still a cat. A drunken ki point is still a ki point.

[Ravingdork]

Zurai wrote:

Generally speaking, an <adjective> <noun> is still a <noun>. A golden toilet is still a toilet; a drunken sailor is still a sailor; a magical cat is still a cat. A drunken ki point is still a ki point.

This is my interpretation as well.

FAQ'd anyways. As always, I'd like official input if possible.