Hey Guys,
I want to play a drow “fey’ri” in an upcoming Second Darkness campaign. For those of you who are unfamiliar with the race, a fey’ri is the elven version of a tiefling and was introduced in 3.0 D&D’s Races’ of Faerun. To obtain a +0 race (or “lesser fey’ri”) I’ve thought of two possible race make ups.
The first version is the simplest. Take you basic tiefling and add the “racial heritage” feat from APG as your first level feat, selecting Drow as the racial heritage. Now your tiefling has pointed ears and dusky grey skin, and we’re done. However, while simple and maybe even elegant, this really isn’t as flavorful or a pleasing mechanical match as I’d like it. Yes, I know "racial heritage" is RAW a human-only feat.
The second version starts out with your basic PF drow. First, remove light blindness and balance by lessening the darkvision to 60 feet and removing dancing lights and poison use. Second, change the drow’s 1/day faerie fire to disguise self. Or, alternatively, make “disguise self” a more limited version by limiting the disguise to only be as an elf, but allowing it to be an at-will power. Third, change type to “outsider (native).” In this version, the final stat block would look like this:
• Stats: +2 Dexterity, +2 Charisma, –2 Constitution: Fey’ri are nimble and manipulative.
• Medium: Fey’ri are Medium creatures, and have no bonuses or penalties due to their size.
• Normal Speed: Fey’ri have a base speed of 30 feet.
• Darkvision: Fey’ri can see in the dark up to 60 feet.
• Fey’ri Immunities – Elven Blooded: Fey’ri are immune to magic sleep effects and get a +2 racial bonus to saves against enchantment spells. Additionally, for all special abilities and effects, a fey’ri is considered an elf (drow).
• Keen Senses: Fey’ri receive a +2 racial bonus on Perception checks.
• Spell Resistance: Fey’ri possess spell resistance equal to 6 plus their class levels.
• Spell-Like Abilities: A fey’ri can cast darkness once per day and can cast disguise self (elf only) at-will, using his total character level as his caster level.
• Weapon Familiarity: Fey’ri (Drow) are proficient with the hand crossbow, rapier, and short sword.
• Languages: Fey’ri begin play speaking Elven and Undercommon. Fey’ri with high Intelligence can choose bonus languages from the following: Abyssal, Aklo, Aquan, Common, Draconic, Drow Sign Language, Gnome, or Goblin.
I think this version is mechanically closer to the original 3.0 Fey’ri, but keeping the LA to +0. It would also allow a player to take one of the fiendish heritage/façade feats at 1st level. And, if you wanted a plain elven tiefling, just change the stats to fit and replace Spell Resistance for Elven Magic. So, what do you think? Do these versions balance with the pre-existing tiefling? What might you do differently?
P.S. I know there is some discussion on whether "native (outsider)" is too powerful, but I'm trying to use the Tiefling, as written, as the benchmark. In otherwords, the change in type isn't what I'm interested in.
I think it sounds good for a +1 ECL race.
I think it sounds good for a +1 ECL race.
Well, what would make it a +0 race? Remember, as written in PF, both Drow (CR 1/3) and Tieflings (CR 1/2, but see PF-Comp: Cheliax) are playable without an ECL adjustment.
Now keep in mind that all of this is only what I would allow as a DM. It's the (at will) for disguise self that really tips it for me. It puts the race at about +1/2, and for such a thing, I would round up.
If you go back to the core races, you'll see that there are a number of abilities, but there is usually one solid racial trait that stands out, such as a dwarf's darkvision, or the halfling's save bonuses. The elves have their sleep immunity, and the drow's big thing is the spell resistance.
This proposed Fey'ri race has darkvision, spell resistance, immunity to magic sleep, spell resistance, darkness, and disguise self, on TOP of free weapon familiarity.
I would lose the spell resistance, disguise self SLA (use the skill for this), and the weapon familiarities. That leaves you with Darkvision (a drow trait), Immunity to sleep (elf trait), and darkness (tiefling trait). Seems solid enough.
But Sphen is right. As that is, it's at least +1. If what I suggest doesn't suit you, try taking what you have and plugging it into the same number of "slots" a core race has of similar types (IE, trading Darkvision for Low Light, but not Spell Resistance for Keen Senses). That should help balance it out.
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Now keep in mind that all of this is only what I would allow as a DM. It's the (at will) for disguise self that really tips it for me. It puts the race at about +1/2, and for such a thing, I would round up.
That and the Outsider type coupled with SR. it has a lot of resistances. As an outsider you could get rid of the + 2 racial bonus to saves against enchantment spells, since its kinda overkill.
personally i'd say drop/limit disguise self to 3/day or 1+cha mod times a day and add light blindness.
the fey’ri i remember from Forgotten realms were closer to half fiends.
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Hey Guys,
I want to play a drow “fey’ri” in an upcoming Second Darkness campaign. For those of you who are unfamiliar with the race, a fey’ri is the elven version of a tiefling and was introduced in 3.0 D&D’s Races’ of Faerun. To obtain a +0 race (or “lesser fey’ri”) I’ve thought of two possible race make ups.
The Fey'ri were not at all tieflings. As posted above, they were half-fiend half sun elves. They are much more powerful than a planetouched race. Tieflings were the elven version of tieflings just as they were the dwarven, human, halfling, gnome, orc and every other race's version of tiefling. If you're looking for a +0 elven tiefling, I suggest using the tiefling. As for the fey'ri, if memory serves, they were +3. Dropping their menu selection of advanced spell-like abilities isn't enough to reduce them to +0.
If you're looking for a drow half-fiend, take a look at the draegloth. It is a drow half-fiend. For a bestiary friendly choice, add the half-fiend template to a drow.
So, I'm taking it that Version 1, isn't have much problem with anyone?
As to Version 2, I would disagree with the limited "disguise self" being equivalent to a + 1/2 ecl given that it is roughly the same as feat (see "fiendish facade"). However, I could easily see going back to replacing the "faerie fire" 1/day with "disguise self" (as written) 1/day.
Remember, the limited disguise self is mostly going to have a role playing effect, not much of a combat effect (except for some sort of surprise role, which, again, is a role not roll playing).
Per ECL, light blindness is a moderate weakness, equivalent to a negative -.5 ECl, or a feat under 3.5. In return for giving up light blindness, the PC would also give up poison use, 60 ft darkvision, and dancing lights (about 3 traits or 1.5 feats).
Personally, I don't have much problem giving up some of the elven immunities stuff, but I'm working off the PF drow. The common drow includes elven immunities. Now, I could see a disagreement with the drow being 1/3 CR (because I agree that it might be a 1/2 CR), but that's how it is written and an entirely different thread.
So, let's go back to the base drow with the following changes 1) replace "faerie fire" with "disguise self", 2) loss of light blindness for dancing lights, poison use, and 60ft darkvision, and 3) change of type to "native (outsider)". Would that prove the PC's base cr greater than the tiefling's?
BTW, thanks for the feedback.
You might want to consider a base +0 ECL race, and then acquire additional fiendish and/or spell-like abilities via racial feats. If you have access to it, see Races of Faerun for drow and fiendish/celestial racial feats... either to use as-is or as examples of power levels for creating your own feat abilities.
Why not just go with a drow sorcerer of the abyssal bloodline? If you take all the spells that the Fey'ri got as spell-like abilities, you end up emulating the concept pretty FN closely.
If you get your GM's permission, you can even play a drow noble and switch out their spell-like abilities (the drow noble entry specifically says some drow nobles have different spells). You can more closely emulate a Fey'ri's abilities this way as well.
We once had a drow in our group who had fireball at will thanks to this. :D
Hey Guys,
I want to play a drow “fey’ri” in an upcoming Second Darkness campaign. For those of you who are unfamiliar with the race, a fey’ri is the elven version of a tiefling and was introduced in 3.0 D&D’s Races’ of Faerun. To obtain a +0 race (or “lesser fey’ri”) I’ve thought of two possible race make ups.
The Fey'ri were not at all tieflings. As posted above, they were half-fiend half sun elves. They are much more powerful than a planetouched race. Tieflings were the elven version of tieflings just as they were the dwarven, human, halfling, gnome, orc and every other race's version of tiefling. If you're looking for a +0 elven tiefling, I suggest using the tiefling. As for the fey'ri, if memory serves, they were +3. Dropping their menu selection of advanced spell-like abilities isn't enough to reduce them to +0.
If you're looking for a drow half-fiend, take a look at the draegloth. It is a drow half-fiend. For a bestiary friendly choice, add the half-fiend template to a drow.
Your memory serves you pretty well.
I think it sounds good for a +1 ECL race.Well, what would make it a +0 race? Remember, as written in PF, both Drow (CR 1/3) and Tieflings (CR 1/2, but see PF-Comp: Cheliax) are playable without an ECL adjustment.
Personally, to make it a 0 EPL race, I'd take out teh Spell-like abilities completely. But that's just me.
These are all excellent suggestions. As RD points out, the easiest RAW thing to do is just take a level of Abyssal Sorcerer. No mess. No fuss.
A fireball at-will? Nice. You are absolutely right, fiddling around with the Drow Noble and soaking the +2/1.5 LA via the PF buyoff would work well and without messing around with the mechanics too much. That's a great suggestion.
Fey’ri Drow
• +4 Dex, +2 Int, +2 Wis, +2, Cha, -2 Con
• DV 120 FT
• Drow Immunities: Immune to Sleep, +2 v. Enchantment
• Deceitful: + 2 Bluff (replacing keen senses)
• SR 11 + Level
• SLA
o 1/day – ea: Divine Favor, Suggestion, Protection from Energy (replacing Dispel Magic)
o At-Will: Prestidigitation (replacing dancing lights), Fly (replacing Deeper Darkness), Disguise Self (replacing Faerie Fire), Detect Thoughts (replacing Feather Fall), Darkness (replacing Levitate)
o Constant: Detect Magic
• Light Blindness
• Wpn Familiarity
• Outsider Subtype (replacing Poison Use)
Also, I found Voodoo Mike's nice "PF Race Building Guide" in the message boards. He uses a point based system for ranking abilities. Using that guide, the Drow, as written, are pretty powerful as +0 race at around 20+ points. Very silly. So, maybe going with the Half-Elf/Drow would be a bit more level for a +0 race.
Using that guide, here is something I came up with.
Half-elf
• Low light Vision 1pt
• Elven Immunities 3pt
• SF 4pt
• Elf Subtype 0pt
• +2 percep 1pt
• Extra Fav Class 4pt
• Total 13pt
Half-drow
• Light Blindness – -2pt
• Darkvison 60 +2pt
• Skill Focus +4pt
• Elv Immunities +3pt
• Drow (elf+) Subtype +1pt
• Percep +2 +1pt
• 2nd Fav class +4pt
• Total +13pt
Deepwyrm Half-drow
• Light Blindness – -2pt
• Darkvison 60 +2pt
• Skill Focus +4pt
• Sleep Immunity +2pt
• Drow & Drgn Subtypes +2pt
• Bluff + 2 +1pt
• Spll Like Abilities +4 pt (See Gnome/Variant for pt)
o Dtct Mag 3/day
o Disguise Self 1/day
• Total +13pt
Fiendish Half Drow
• Light Blindness – -2pt
• Darkvison 60 +2pt
• Skill Focus +4pt
• Sleep Immunity +2pt
• Drow & Outsider Subtype +2pt
• Bluff + 2 +1pt
• Spll Like Abilities +4pt
o Dancing Light, Dtct Mag, Disguise Self: 1/day
• Total +13pt
Yes, I know "drow" & "outsider" really are not PF subtypes. After all, a ranger with "Humanoid (Elf)" as a favorite enemy will strike a Drow just as hard. However, Drow have access to Drow only feats. And, the subtype is an easy way to indicate the "elven blood" ability.
Not to be a putz, but I thought Fey'ri were sun elves, not drow.
I believe you are correct. There are no canon drow fey'ri.
That said, I think for a "fiendish drow" concept I would do as ravingdork suggested--Abyssal Bloodline Drow--or alternately just apply the Fiendish Template to a drow (give it fire and cold resistance 5 and the ability to smite good 1/day; check with GM if could get boosted DR and resistances down the line as HD increase).