Does size penalty for AC of large creatures also apply to CMD?


Rules Questions


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I have a dispute with a friend on the interpretation of the latter of two sentences on p. 199 under Combat Maneuver Defense:

"A creature can also add any circumstance, deflection, dodge, insight, morale, profane, and sacred bonuses to AC to its CMD. Any penalties to a creature's AC also apply to its CMD."

I assume that the second sentence is affected by the first, and so that the penalties to AC mentioned in the second sentence should be of one of the types listed in the first sentence.

My friend thinks that the second sentence stands alone, and so applies to any penalties at all, including size penalties. This would mean, for example, that a large creature would get a special size bonus to its CMD of +1 that is immediately cancelled out by the size penalty to AC that large creatures get.

So who is right here? Or is something else right?


I believe the size penalty should have been listed as an exception. It should not be applied to the CMD. I'm fairly sure a Paizo representative said so in another thread a while back.

Shadow Lodge

Yeah, otherwise what would be the point of the size mod to cmd if its negated by the size mod from AC?

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