Running a module that has a Bodak in it. I don't see a Pathfinder equivalent. I can still just run the 3.5 version and give them less XP (CR-1) but was wondering of someone had written up a Pathfinder one.
-- david
Papa.DRB
Use the Conversion Guide, looks like a monster easy to convert. (just needs CMD, CMB and a few other things)
Man, I hate the Bodak. Either feeble or kills PCs outright.
Hmm. I like Bodaks. But, then, I liked the old "Giant Rattlesnake," what with the "Save vs. Poison or DIE!!!!! (Horribly over several turns!!!")
Back on topic, I don't even think you'd need to drop the CR on a Bodak. But as bagpuss implies, mind the save DCs or things could get ugly - one way or another. You want that bodak to be a definite risk, but not a quick TPK.
When looking at the Bodak in the SRD, and comparing it to the Monster Creation charts, and a comparable creature with a death gaze ability (the Medusa), he really should be sitting at around a CR 5.
The problem with that though, is that the ability to respond to a death gaze attack at CR 5 is very low. 5th level characters don't have many options against being killed by a save or die, and death ward protection is two levels away.
The Medusa (with a save or "die" gaze) is CR 7, for example, which is in the range of death ward stuff.
Honestly, at CR 8, the Bodak has far too little hitpoints, too slow speed to catch up to anyone quickly, too low saves for the CR, and no inherent ability to surprise the party with the death gaze (ability scores are crap, and feat choices don't reinforce it).
He's not even good enough to surprise the party in 3.5e, since he had no Hide bonuses (just move silently), and at a slower speed and weak hitpoints/saves, the party could spot him and just take him down at range within a single round.
A low level party that is appropriate to his hitpoints/ac/saves/attacks would rightly get overwhelmed by the death gaze.. but that's more a factor of access to death prevention than anything else.
I'd say it's probably best to re-write the Bodak as a proper CR 8 challenge, with the suggested HD for that CR (12HD).
It shouldn't be too hard to do a straight conversion with higher HD, I'll post it up here in a moment.
Here's what I think a Bodak at CR 8 should look like.
I also added a bit of new stuff to give him a little more versatility in combat, and added some Surprise! factor so his death gaze kicks in better.
BODAK
CE Medium undead (extraplanar); CR 8
Init +8; Senses darkvision 60 ft.; Perception +13
AC 21, touch 15, flat-footed 16 (+4 Dex, +1 Dodge, +6 natural)
hp 78 (12d8+24)
Fort +6, Ref +8, Will +9
Weaknesses sunlight vulnerability
Speed 20 ft. (4 squares)
Melee slam +12 (1d6+4)
Atk Options death gaze, frightening leap
Base Atk +9; CMB +12; CMD 26
Str 16, Dex 19, Con -, Int 6, Wis 12, Cha 15
Feats Dodge, Improved Initiative, Improved Natural Attack (slam), Intimidating Prowess, Run, Skill Focus (perception)
Skills Perception +13, Stealth +15 (+23 in dim light or darkness), Intimidate +18; Racial Modifiers +4 Stealth (+8 in dim light or darkness)
Death Gaze (Su) Death, range 30 feet, Fortitude DC 18 negates. Humanoids who die from this attack are transformed into bodaks 24 hours later. The save DC is Charisma-based.
Frightening Leap (Su) When making a charge action, the bodak can move with frightening speed that instills fear his his target. The bodak may move three times his speed on a charge, and he gets a free intimidate check to demoralize prior to attacking his target.
Sunlight Vulnerability Bodaks loathe sunlight, for its merest touch burns their impure flesh. Each round of exposure to the direct rays of the sun deals 1 point of damage to the creature.
I agree with Bagpuss,
possible solution replace the death stare effect to be save= 1 con drain; fail = 2d6 con drain, maybe give it's melee attack 1 con drain as well.
less of a win/lose difference
You guys realize that the CR 7 Medusa has a gaze attack that's Fort save or turn to stone permanently, right?
Creative Director
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The bodak is in Bestiary 2.
It's on-off live-dead death gaze is a problem. On one level, it's cool flavor that something can strike things dead with a glance. On another, it sucks to have a PC look around a corner, fail a save, and then be dead for a session. A guy in my regular Saturday game STILL complains about that, even though it happened about a decade ago.
In the Bestiary 2, the bodak's gaze doesn't cause instant death. Instead it causes 1d6 negative levels. Which can kill pretty quickly, but generally not immediately. And it's still something that's really bad and you need to deal with as soon as possible, but it doesn't punish the party for a sudden bit of unluck.
As for the medusa... it's turn to stone gaze is something I sort of agonized over. I nerfed the gorgon, the cockatrice, and the basilisk. But in the end I let the medusa keep her gaze as-is. I probably should have given it some sort of softener, I guess... but I just couldn't bring myself to do it. Sometimes, it's hard to declaw the monster and put safeties on every aspect of the game without hurting the game's traditions, I guess.
The Bodak (at least in 3.5), had really dismal everything for it's CR. The only thing that justified having anywhere near that high a CR is the fact that it could kill with a gaze.
It was a fairly low DC too (DC 15).
With a wimpy slam attack, low AC/Hitpoints/Saves and no other tactical options in it's skills or abilities, it's basically a one-trick pony that will have face time of about 1 round.
All it's eggs in one basket, sort of thing.
So yeah, if the intention is to take away the mechanic that is problematic, then this guy needs something to reinforce his raison d'etre. A stronger set of physical attacks.. a set of Su abilities for fear or death or negative energy.. a statblock worthy of a CR 8 creature, that kind of thing.
It would certainly make the creature more interesting in play.
I nerfed the gorgon
The Golden Ram's variant breath was funny, too.
They were totally freaking out and wondering how much time had passed. Was it a couple of minutes? A decade? Would the world be ruled by apes when they got back??
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Creative Director
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So yeah, if the intention is to take away the mechanic that is problematic, then this guy needs something to reinforce his raison d'etre. A stronger set of physical attacks.. a set of Su abilities for fear or death or negative energy.. a statblock worthy of a CR 8 creature, that kind of thing.
It would certainly make the creature more interesting in play.
He'll remain a CR 8 creature, and his other attributes will increase to make him more viable at CR 8, but his death gaze will be reduced to a leveldrainer as I detail above.
Monsters that are super swingy like the 3.5 bodak are too tough to use, frankly.
I've heard of some people liking the swinginess, with various reasons for why.
I personally like seeing a creature in play for longer than a round. Save or Die encounters like the Bodak tended towards "kill it! kill it now! kill it with fire!" type of attitudes... but never really hit home the "oh thank goodness we survived" feelings later.
Mostly it's just a speedbump or someone's not playing the rest of the night type of situation, instead of the "nuclear device counting down" type of horror.
Thanks for the information. I think that I will beef him up to be a real CR 8 but use the d6 negative levels.
By the way, this is in the Legacy of Fire AP, Chapter 5, so the PCs are 11th level and *shouldn't* have a problem, but all it takes is a roll of 1 on the save and someone is screwed.
-- david
Papa.DRB
The bodak is in Bestiary 2.
In the Bestiary 2, the bodak's gaze doesn't cause instant death. Instead it causes 1d6 negative levels. Which can kill pretty quickly, but generally not immediately. And it's still something that's really bad and you need to deal with as soon as possible, but it doesn't punish the party for a sudden bit of unluck.