So I'm looking at the monster creation guide and it states that an animal or magical beast gets 2 + int mod ranks per HD, but gets a minimum of 1 if it has a low intelligence score that would reduce it to 0.
Then I got, okay, so this Dire Gorilla gets 4 skill ranks. Okay, it has four skills, that works, it must get training bonuses. Why doesn't it list all the bonuses it's getting?
What's going on, then I go and look at this creature called the Splicer beast from Kobold Quarterly.
http://www.koboldquarterly.com/k/front-page5527.php
People are saying it's skills are right by comments, HOWEVER, when following the rules it has 3 skill ranks, and it has 4 skills.. Someone, PLEASE explain how the hell the skill rank system works for monsters.
Because right now I'm willing to bet that I can take any creature in the Beastiary and find out that its skill ranks don't freaking according to the creation guide.
I'm so confused!
My cloaker calculation failed, set fixed it.
Just tried the calculation out with a homebrew creature I found on these boards.
It looks all good up until the last two, not enough skill ranks from what I'm seeing.
Someone please explain to me how this works, where are they getting these high scores?
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Okay, I just calculated up the cloaker, someone please tell me if I'm mistaken.
4 + Int mod per HD
Str +5
Dex +3
Con +4
Int +2
Wis +2
Cha +233 of 36 Ranks
Disguise (3 Dex, 5 Ranks
Fly (3 Dex, 7 ranks
Know Relig (2 int, 9 ranks
Percep (2 Wis, 3 ranks, skill focus 3
Sense Mot (2 wis, 6 ranks
Stealth (3 dex, 5 ranksFrom what I'm seeing, his perception is too high.
As a 6 HD creature, it can't have more than 6 ranks in any skill, and should have 36 skill ranks total (4 + Int mod).
As an Aberration, it has the following Class Skills; Acrobatics, Climb, Escape Artist, Fly, Intimidate, Knowledge (pick one), Perception, Spellcraft, Stealth, Survival, Swim. That looks like what you are missing, class skills.
The write up is still not accurate, 'though, which isn't helping;
Disguise; 6 ranks, +2 Cha = +8
Fly; 4 ranks, +3 Dex, +3 class skill = +10
Knowledge (religion); 6 ranks, +2 Int, +3 class skill = +11
Perception; 6 ranks, +2 for Wis, +3 for Skill Focus, +3 class skill = +14
Sense Motive; 6 ranks, +2 Wisdom, = +8
Stealth; 3 ranks, +3 Dex, -4 size penalty, +3 class skill, = +5
31 of 36 ranks spent.
It's also due two more languages, due to it's Int of 14.
If it just assigned 6 ranks to each skill, it should have +12 Fly and +8 Stealth, and be otherwise correct.
Wow! I messed that one up, okay, fair enough. However, where did you locate what are class skills and out of class skills for the creatures.
Also what about my first examples, the gorilla, and the splicer beast.
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Wow, i messed that one up, okay, fair enough. However, where did you locate what are class skills and out of class skills for the creatures.
Bestiary 306-310.
Also, what about my first examples, the gorilla, and the splicer beast.
I'll get back to you on that, unless I forget, heading to the gym. :)
I seldom bother to reference my beastiary and primarily use the SRD, I find it faster.
Just didn't know where it was on the SRD. Thank you, Set. Time for me to go and try once more with the prior.
Okay, looking at the Ape.
4 HD, 4 of 4 Skill Ranks
(3 Trained, 2 Dex, 1 rank) Acrobatics
(4 Str, 3 Trained, +8 Racial, 1 rank) Climb
(3 Trained, 1 Wis, 1 rank, +3 Skill) Perception
(1 rank, 3 trained, 2 dex) Stealth
+6 Acrobatics
+16 Climb
+8 Perception
+2 Stealth
Acrobatics, Climb, Fly, Perception, Stealth, and Swim.
--------------------------------------
We notice that he has a +2 to stealth, however, doing the calculations reveals to us that he has 1 rank left to spend. If we place that into stealth, and tack on the dex, and trained mods. It becomes a +6 Skill.
Thus it is currently under my belief now that ALL creatures in the beastiary have incorrect skill totals. This has altered my prior believe in a way that, I had believe they were all too high. I now believe that the creatures are MISSING skill ranks or something.
Not to mention I figured out that the ape is missing a +8 Racial mod list. As in, the racial mod is NOT being listed.
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Not to mention I figured out that the ape is missing a +8 Racial mod list. As in, the racial mod is NOT being listed.
That's just annoying, but it's under the Climb skill in the PFRPG (p 91, under Special at the end), that all creatures with a climb speed get a +8 to Climb checks. (I would guess they didn't want to put it under the Racial Modifier, so that people didn't add it twice, thinking it was an actual Racial Modifier and not a freebie that comes with a Climb speed.)
Anywho;
1 rank in Acrobatics +2 for Dex, +3 for class skill = +6
1 rank in Climb +3 for Str, +3 for class skill, +8 for having a Climb speed = +16
1 rank in Perception +1 for Wisdom, +3 for class skill, +3 for Skill Focus = +8
1 rank in Stealth +2 for Dex, +3 for class skill, -4 for size penalty = +2
The Dire Ape, amazingly, appears to be correct, once the size penalty for size Large to Stealth and the Climb speed +8 bonus to Climb checks are counted in.
I have been corrected! Again, lol. My human power is no match for that of the god Set.
Man I am really failing today, missing out on so many things, lol. >< My bad, thank you Set.
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I have been corrected! Again, lol. My human power is no match for that of the god Set.
Darn tootin!
Man I am really failing today, missing out on so many things, lol. >< My bad, thank you Set.
Nah, that Cloaker definitely looked off on the Fly and the Stealth checks. I have no idea what's up with those skills.
The class skill thing, the size penalties and the unnamed bonus that comes with a Climb speed snarled you up, but that's all stuff that wasn't mentioned in the write-ups and require searching through the back of the book for what critters get what class skills and the skills themselves to find out what sort of bonuses and penalties show up and why, so it's completely normal to expect to see right there the modifiers.
I prefer writing my skills; Acrobatics 1 (+4), Climb (CC) 3 (+5), etc. so that I can see how many ranks I spent, and not just a naked modifier with no rationale for how it got that way.
I seldom bother to reference my beastiary and primarily use the SRD, I find it faster.
Just didn't know where it was on the SRD. Thank you, Set. Time for me to go and try once more with the prior.
You can find it HERE
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I think the cloaker skills are actually:
Disquise: 6 ranks, +2 cha = 8
Fly: 6 ranks, +3 dex, +3 class, -2 size = 10
Know (religion): 6 ranks, +2 int, +3 class = 11
Perception: 6 ranks, +2 wis, +3 class, +3 skill focus = 14
Sense Motive: 6 ranks, +2 wis = 8
Stealth: 6 ranks, +3 dex, +3 class, -4 size (large) = 8So they do add up just fine.
Hope this helps,
Mead
Good catch on the size modifier to the Fly skill. I hadn't noticed that one.
But the Bestiary lists it's Stealth modifier as +5, not +8, so there's still a three point discrepancy there, that you haven't accounted for.
Just checked, it is correct at the PRD, which is cool. Must just be an error in the printed Bestiary.