Im thinking of changing the Master Craftsman Feat and want peoples opinions. There is an Encounter in Kingmaker Adventure Path that i will use as an example Below.
Master Craftman change would be that you could take it at level 1, But can't use it to create your own Magic items till you have 5 ranks. The Use for it before then would be to create items that MAY become magical but only for you. Example Below:
Old Crackjaw in Book 2. If the Parties DRUID decides to make the Shell in to a shield, it would gain the WILD property. But only for that one druid and it does not radiate magic. It just works like its magic.
Does anyone like the idea? hate it? Suggestions? And why if you give any please.
Thanks
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Im thinking of changing the Master Craftsman Feat and want peoples opinions. There is an Encounter in Kingmaker Adventure Path that i will use as an example Below.
Master Craftman change would be that you could take it at level 1, But can't use it to create your own Magic items till you have 5 ranks. The Use for it before then would be to create items that MAY become magical but only for you. Example Below:
** spoiler omitted **
Does anyone like the idea? hate it? Suggestions? And why if you give any please.
Thanks
So you mean to make is available to anyone so as to make items with Supernatural abilities? It is a neat concept, say you could seek out special components to make neat specifically non-magical items with unique powers?
To me is sounds like a whole lot of work putting that many things in your world you could utilize to make special weapons and armor. It would probably be a b+*$$ to get your hands on and expensive but it would definatley help bridge the gap from the low levels. I could see this being really cool in a low magic setting where magic is rare or weak.
I don't like the flavor of it.
Master Craftsman. Not Apprentice Craftsman, or Journeyman Craftsman, or Noob Craftsman, or Gosh I wish I were a Master Craftsman.
To me, 5th level is too early for anyone to be called a "Master" at any craft.
There is already a Skill Focus feat to represent someone who is dedicated, focused, or talented boyond ordinary people. So if I want a level 1 commoner to be an exceptional baskeweaver, I can give him Skill Focus (Basketweaving). At level 1, he is still just an apprentice, but he's a very dedicated and focused apprentice.
As for me, I prefer saving the term "Master" for someone who's actually earned it. I rather wish that Pathfinder would have added Skill Focus in the chosen craft or profession skill as a prerequisite for Master Craftsman. 5 ranks just doesn't seem very dedicated to me. Heck, my wizard has 5 ranks in several skills without even trying, and he's never lifted a hammer, or any other tool, in his life. I certainly wouldn't espouse making this feat any easier to obtain.
Mechanically speaking, there would be almost no problem with your change. Of course, with your houserule, a 1st level human commoner could easily get +5 on a crafting or profession skill by taking this feat and Skill Focus at level 1. I doubt that would upset too many campaigns though, so there probably isn't any real game-breaking mechanical reason not to make the change.
Not to be *that* guy, but here is a great article backing up the OP, and providing a counterpoint argument to DM_Blake:
Please bear in mind that the original article is in 3.0/3.5 but the general concepts stay the same.
Also you could go the other way around, and not allow skill focus for commoner's. skilled craftsman already have an npc class....expert.
Not to be *that* guy, but here is a great article backing up the OP, and providing a counterpoint argument to DM_Blake:
Please bear in mind that the original article is in 3.0/3.5 but the general concepts stay the same.
Also you could go the other way around, and not allow skill focus for commoner's. skilled craftsman already have an npc class....expert.
FWIW, when I said "commoner" I wasn't referencing a NPC class, I was using the term more loosely to reference "any ordinary person".
As for the article, yeah, I call BS. Yeah, yeah, most everything he says in there is more or less true. It's what he left out that breaks his "calibration".
If it's true that the Einsteins of the world are no more than 5th level, then why are there so many high-level NPCs all over the place? Pick up any Paizo AP and you'll quickly see that there are NPCs running around at 15th level trying to rule their own little corners of the world. Who are they if everything above 5th level is "super human"?
How can anyone even get into an ordinary prestige class? Are there actually no assassins in Golarion? Or are they all just pretentius rogues pretending they're something they're not? Or is every assassin in Golarion a demi-god among men?
And who in the world fights all the giants, dragons, demons, purple worms, liches, etc? Golarion is full of this stuff, and even just a couple such creatures could destroy the world if the ordinary soldier is only level 1 or so? According to this essay, "the most talented people in the world are level 4, and anyone who is level 5 will be written about in history books like Einstein or Shakespeare". Only a few of those in a generation, so the absolte best soldiers are level 4 and those are extremely rare, most are level 1 or 2 with absolutely no high level veterans or officers. Such an army would be laid to waste by a single mid-sized dragon in no time, and then the rest of the world would fall to the same dragon (unless some other dragon stopped it).
No, this essay only looks at half of the game system, trying to shove real-world numbers into a skill system that is abstract and somewhat silly to begin with.
Sure, if we want to juggle the skill numbers and base the whole world off of them, this essay might be helpful. But, since Golarion is a world that is already populated with innumerable characters who range well into the double-digits in levels, then we already know his numbers are off. Unless we want to assume that your average 6th level wizard who has never even heard of a slide-rule could run circles around Einstein in a physics debate.
And let's not forget, that an average, muscly farm-boy can head off to the big city, get a job as a rookie in the city watch, and if he breaks up just one barroom brawl every week, or chases down just one burglar in the streets each week, or otherwise has just one incident a week that he is involved in, he'll be 4th level by the end of his rookie year, and 6th level by the end of his second year, just leveling off the encouter XP for doing his job. God forbid this kid gets put in the dangerous side of town; if he survives he could do all that in his first 6 months having just one incident each day he goes to work.
Rising to 6th level in 6 months doesn't seem too hard for a city watchman, so why must it be impossible for a physicist, a playwrite, or a blacksmith?
No, I think this essay's analysis, while mathematically sound, is far from representative of the entire game system, and cannot "calibrate my expectations" in a vacuum that only considers the skill system and excludes all the rest of the game.
The article shows that the system replicates the real world reasonably well (at least better than most admit), and provides a sound argument for people to understand that a world with characters above level 5 is a fantastical world indeed. It is a world of myth and legend, & PCs are among the figures that can "perform feats you've only heard in song".
So you mean to make is available to anyone so as to make items with Supernatural abilities? It is a neat concept, say you could seek out special components to make neat specifically non-magical items with unique powers?
To me is sounds like a whole lot of work putting that many things in your world you could utilize to make special weapons and armor. It would probably be a b&@#@ to get your hands on and expensive but it would definatley help bridge the gap from the low levels. I could see this being really cool in a low magic setting where magic is rare or weak.
I actually wasnt gonna add anything new, or make it like a "I want to make this..." It would just happen. Like in Old D&D novels when a weapon just Became Magical. If they make there own gear from Unique and different items that you normally may not use then there is a chance it becomes magical for them only.
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I actually wasnt gonna add anything new, or make it like a "I want to make this..." It would just happen. Like in Old D&D novels when a weapon just Became Magical. If they make there own gear from Unique and different items that you normally may not use then there is a chance it becomes magical for them only.So you mean to make is available to anyone so as to make items with Supernatural abilities? It is a neat concept, say you could seek out special components to make neat specifically non-magical items with unique powers?
To me is sounds like a whole lot of work putting that many things in your world you could utilize to make special weapons and armor. It would probably be a b&@#@ to get your hands on and expensive but it would definatley help bridge the gap from the low levels. I could see this being really cool in a low magic setting where magic is rare or weak.
That's easy enough to do without changing the rules. Think of how many powerful magical weapons are named. What's to stop you from letting a character pick up the heirloom weapon trait (and adding an heirloom armor trait) and simply upgrading the weapon as he levels (while reducing WBL accordingly)? This fits more with what you're trying to do IMO.
Additionally, you might want to check out the 3.5 splat book (IIRC it was weapons of legend or something like that). It had rules for giving up XP, taking negatives on HP, saves, to hit, etc. as your weapon becomes more powerful.
EDIT: look like i was ninja'd by the OP saying this is pretty much exactly what he was going to do.
I actually wasnt gonna add anything new, or make it like a "I want to make this..." It would just happen. Like in Old D&D novels when a weapon just Became Magical. If they make there own gear from Unique and different items that you normally may not use then there is a chance it becomes magical for them only.So you mean to make is available to anyone so as to make items with Supernatural abilities? It is a neat concept, say you could seek out special components to make neat specifically non-magical items with unique powers?
To me is sounds like a whole lot of work putting that many things in your world you could utilize to make special weapons and armor. It would probably be a b&@#@ to get your hands on and expensive but it would definatley help bridge the gap from the low levels. I could see this being really cool in a low magic setting where magic is rare or weak.
That's easy enough to do without changing the rules. Think of how many powerful magical weapons are named. What's to stop you from letting a character pick up the heirloom weapon trait (and adding an heirloom armor trait) and simply upgrading the weapon as he levels (while reducing WBL accordingly)? This fits more with what you're trying to do IMO.
Additionally, you might want to check out the 3.5 splat book (IIRC it was weapons of legend or something like that). It had rules for giving up XP, taking negatives on HP, saves, to hit, etc. as your weapon becomes more powerful.
EDIT: look like i was ninja'd by the OP saying this is pretty much exactly what he was going to do.
Haha thats funny. I didnt even think of using the Weapons of Legacy Book. hahah. I might have to go dig that out now. Thanks :D