|
Looking at the Arcane Trickster, I've noticed a small "loophole" of sorts, and wanted to know if anyone thought this might be a plausible build:
1) Rogue/Witch/Arcane Trickster. If you take the Minor Magic rogue talent, you can technically cast Mage Hand, which the witch doesn't know. Not only do I like the flavor, but you get things like the Slumber Hex, which... yeah, it's nice with all the sneak attack loving.
2) Rogue/Any Arcane Class/Any Divine Caster Class. Yes, you would lose three levels to whatever arcane casting class you chose (probably either Wizard or Witch, so I'd prefer either the Hexes or Divination), but you could pull off Arcane Trickster and level up a Divine Class's spells while gaining sneak attack.
Now, I KNOW this isn't optimal. That's not the point. My question is, could it WORK?
1. I would give a technical no. The minor magic is a spell like ability not a spell in and of itself -- however as an allowance by a DM it wouldn't break the game. Most people like AT for the sneak attack on damage spells which the witch doesn't have many of though.
2. Yes it would work technically. The wording on AT allows you to choose the class you want to level you spell casting in so you could choose a divine spell class.
|
|
My argument for #1:
The AT does not require you to be able to cast Mage Hand as a spell, it simply requires that you be able to cast Mage Hand. Normally, one might make an argument that you don't "cast" spell-like abilities, but in the wording of the Rogue Talent: Minor Magic;
"A rogue with this talent gains the ability to cast a 0-level spell from the sorcerer/wizard spell list. This spell can be cast three times a day as a spell-like ability."
*[emphasis mine]*
From the AT:
"Spells: Ability to cast mage hand and at least one arcane spell of 2nd level or higher."
From the Rogue:
"Minor Magic (Sp): A rogue with this talent gains the ability to cast a 0-level spell from the sorcerer/wizard spell list. This spell can be cast three times a day as a spell-like ability. The caster level for this ability is equal to the rogue's level. The save DC for this spell is 10 + the rogue's Intelligence modifier. The rogue must have an Intelligence of at least 10 to select this talent."
(SP) means spell like ability, the AT has a requirement of spells ability to cast mage hand and at least one arcane spell of 2nd level or higher. This means he must cast as a spell.
Now I'm not saying that allowing this would break the game -- but it's not the same thing. Spell like abilities =/= spells.
|
|
From the AT:
"Spells: Ability to cast mage hand and at least one arcane spell of 2nd level or higher."
From the Rogue:
"Minor Magic (Sp): A rogue with this talent gains the ability to cast a 0-level spell from the sorcerer/wizard spell list. This spell can be cast three times a day as a spell-like ability. The caster level for this ability is equal to the rogue's level. The save DC for this spell is 10 + the rogue's Intelligence modifier. The rogue must have an Intelligence of at least 10 to select this talent."
(SP) means spell like ability, the AT has a requirement of spells ability to cast mage hand and at least one arcane spell of 2nd level or higher. This means he must cast as a spell.
Now I'm not saying that allowing this would break the game -- but it's not the same thing. Spell like abilities =/= spells.
Curses! Well, I'm not one to stretch the rules too thin, even if it isn't game-breaking. I understand that Spell-like Abilities =/= Spells, I just didn't realize that it specifically listed Mage Hand under required "Spells"... I thought it was just under "Requirements".
I generally interpret that you have to level your spell casting in the class that QUALIFIES you for the PrC. so the Witch spellcasting can not be advanced that way.1. I would give a technical no. The minor magic is a spell like ability not a spell in and of itself -- however as an allowance by a DM it wouldn't break the game. Most people like AT for the sneak attack on damage spells which the witch doesn't have many of though.
2. Yes it would work technically. The wording on AT allows you to choose the class you want to level you spell casting in so you could choose a divine spell class.
+1, otherwise it's just silly.
If a character had more than one spellcasting class before becoming an arcane trickster, she must decide to which class she adds the new level for purposes of determining spells per day
This does not say anything about needing to qualify for the prestige class on the basis of the class you add to.
However, since the class is called Arcane Trickster, I think it should have had an extra little bit of text specifying "arcane spellcasting class" rather than just "spellcasting class". I believe some of the later 3.5 splatbooks started using such text for prestige classes.
+1, otherwise it's just silly.I generally interpret that you have to level your spell casting in the class that QUALIFIES you for the PrC. so the Witch spellcasting can not be advanced that way.1. I would give a technical no. The minor magic is a spell like ability not a spell in and of itself -- however as an allowance by a DM it wouldn't break the game. Most people like AT for the sneak attack on damage spells which the witch doesn't have many of though.
2. Yes it would work technically. The wording on AT allows you to choose the class you want to level you spell casting in so you could choose a divine spell class.
+1, and I'd point out that a Teifling can cast Darkness (a second level arcane spell) as a spell like ability. So, if you start allowing that, Tieflings can qualify as AT's and don't have to have a spellcasting class at all. That would be really silly.