Actions and Combat Feats


Rules Questions

Grand Lodge

From reading the threads it seems to me that the intention of feats is, for the most part, for them to not be "stackable." Feats that require any variation of a Standard Action cannot be stacked, as each requires its own Standard Action. I have come to look upon as the feat is its own type of action and not an enhancement to the attack action. For example, Vital Strike is its own attack, not just enhancing a Standard Attack. That may be over simplifying things...

The same seems to hold true for Full Round Attacks. Though there are darn few feats that can be used with a Full Round Attack, I am not really worried about these.

More confusion appears for Attacks of Opportunity than anything else.

Anyway, I wanted to see if this is indeed the consensus of the board and the any designers who wish to comment.


There's a thread that answers your question. You probably have to dig for it but James has answered you question in it. I think it was the thread on using Vital Strike and Spring Attack.

Just to note that Vital strike is not it's own action but you apply it to an attack action. Attack action just happen to be standard actions. Cleave on the other hand is it's own Standard Action.

There is a list of standard actions which are attack actions in the Core book. They include a list Melee Attack, Ranged Attack, Unarmed Attack, Natural Attack, and multiple attack. You can use Vital Strike on any of these. That's where the question of using it with Spring Attack came up since spring attack allows you to move then make single melee attack and move again. Since Melee Attack is an attack action you can stack these two feats.


I am not really sure what the question is, but I will give it a go.

Most of the feats you mention require a standard action as such they cannot be combined.

There are exceptions though, most notably among full-round action feats some, like rapid shot and many shot, state the are used "as part of full attack action" those that have that sort of wording can indeed be combined.

AoO only permit you to do single melee attacks. Hence none of the feats you mention can be used for an AoO. AoO are basically either a normal melee attack or a combat maneuver (except, grapple, overrun and bullrush which are standard actions to use).

NINJA'D by voska66


voska66 wrote:

There's a thread that answers your question. You probably have to dig for it but James has answered you question in it. I think it was the thread on using Vital Strike and Spring Attack.

I think this might be the thread you are thinking of.

Grand Lodge

I am beginning to see the design reasons behind certain feats finally. Must say not easy at all.

In essence, feats can be said to be spells (I know I know- just go with me on the analogy). You can only cast one spell per Standard Action. Any Feat that requires a Standard Action cannot be combined with another feat requiring a Standard Action.

There are still plenty of feats that it can combine with, such as Power Attack and Spring Attack (which do not require a specified action type), and even the Crit feats.

I think part of my thinking has been a legacy of 3.x The fighter got so few feats that by limiting their combination it rendered the class useless at higher levels. Pathfinder has gone through design to fix that problem with more feats and in some cases broader (or simplified) uses of old feats.

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