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I just can't get how to do monster size adjustment in PFRPG. It came up tonight while running a 3.5 module, where the gargantuan centipede is statted out in the MM but not in the Beastiary. I used the quick rules, fine except it couldn't hit worth a darn on 7th level PCs and wasn't the least bit scarry, so I'd like to know what it should be by the book.
I never have understood how to do size adjustments and I would appreciate your help. A lot of people would benefit, I think, if someone could do a walkthrough of using the rules in the Beastiary to go up and down the size scale with the centipede. Please demonstrate how to use the size adjustment rules to create stat blocks for each of the centipede variants on the centipede entry. Thank you.
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/monsters/centipede.html#centipede-giant
House centipede
Sewer centipede
Hissing centipede
Giant whiptail centipede
Great forest centipede
Titan centipede
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 6
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Titan centipede as an example:
Add up medium -> large, large -> huge, huge -> gargantuan, gargantuan -> colossal
That's -8 to AC and attack rolls (for the size), -16 to Stealth, +8 to CMB/CMD
Str +32
Dex -4
Con +16
Nat armor +14
Bite goes from 1d6 damage to 4d6 damage (per the chart on page 302)
HD goes from 1d8 to 10d8. This adds +7 BAB (you lose the points at 5 and 9), +5 to good saves, +3 to bad saves
So now from the top of the stat block:
Init +0
AC 18, touch 2, flat-footed 18 (14 - 2 - 8 -> net +4)
hp 135 (easiest to recalc from scratch)
Fort +16, Ref +3, Will +3
Melee bite +14 (BAB 7, +15 from Str, -8 from size), 4d6+22 (+15 * 1.5)
Str 41, Dex 11, Con 28, Int -, Wis 10, Cha 2
Base Atk +7; CMB +30; CMD 40 (can't be tripped)
Skills Climb +23, Perception +4, Stealth -8
Poison you can tune up as you wish. The DC should probably lose the +2 racial bonus, as it is already 24 without help. Might make it last 6 rounds for 1d4 Dex per round.
Something that size probably deserve a trample ability, plus the mental image is fun.
Compared to the estimates for CR 9 on page 291:
AC - quite low (ac 18 vs 23)
Hit points - high (135 vs. 115), offsets the low AC a bit
Attack - nearer the low column (+14 vs. 12/17)
Damage - in between the two columns (36 vs. 30/40)
Save DC - much higher than normal (24 vs. 18)
Its saves - Fort is running high (16 vs. 12), the other two low (+3 vs. 8)
Ballparking those is why I'd give it a trample, since it otherwise is running a little weak for CR 9 other than the poison.
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Thank you very much for your time on this. You helped me identify a number of potential sources of information I was overlooking. Please check my work and see if I have this right. Going up just one size:
Medium -> Large
Table 2-2 (p. 296)
+8 STR
-2 DEX
+4 CON
+2 Nat Armor
Table 2-3 (p. 296)
-1 AC/Attack
+1 CMB/CMD
-2 Fly skill
-4 Stealth skill
Table 3-1 (p. 302)
1d8 bite dmg.
Centipede variant table (p. 43)
2d8 HD
(? if not specified, this comes from table 1-2, p. 291 ?)
Table 1-4 (p. 293)
Fort is vermin good save
2/HD+int mod vermin skill points
1 Feat
Table 1-6 (p. 293)
+1 BAB (total)
+3 Good save (total)
+0 Bad save (total)
(? am I getting this from the right table, your calc was difference between 1 HD {+2 good save} and 10 HD {+7 good save} ?)
Poison DC 16 (Universal Monster Rules, p. 302; 10 +1/2HD +CON mod +racial)
So, stats:
Hissing centipede CR1
XP 400
N Large vermin
Init +1 (+1 dex mod); Senses darkvision 60 ft.; Perception +4
AC 14, touch 10, flat-footed 14 (+1 Dex, +4 natural, -1 size)
hp 15 (2d8+6)
Fort +6 (+3 base, +3 con), Ref +1 (+1 dex), Will +0
Immune mind-affecting effects
Speed 40 ft., climb 40 ft.
Space 10 ft. long, Reach 5
Melee bite +3 (+1 BAB, +3 str, -1 size) (1d8+4 plus poison)
Special Attacks poison (Fort DC 16, 1/round for 6, 1d3 Dex, save)
Str 17 (+3), Dex 13 (+1), Con 16 (+3), Int —, Wis 10, Cha 2
BAB +1, CMB +4; CMD 15 (can't be tripped)
Feats ?
Skills Climb +14, Perception +4, Stealth +5
Questions: With the str being higher than the dex, does the large centipede pick a new feat, or is it most fair to stick it with a feat it doesn't use? Where did it's original +10 climb come from anyhow? How is speed affected by size increase?
Questions: With the str being higher than the dex, does the large centipede pick a new feat, or is it most fair to stick it with a feat it doesn't use? Where did it's original +10 climb come from anyhow? How is speed affected by size increase?
It certainly makes sense to replace the feat with something different.
The high Climb skill bonus is due to the fact that it has a climb speed - any creature with a climb speed gets a +8 racial bonus to Climb skill checks (see the description of this skill).
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 6
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Since vermin don't get feats (except for bonus feats), I'd just drop the weapon finesse feat altogether.
As for CR - got that from the table. If you don't have a handty table, you have to guesstimate from what the stats come out as.
Other than that, looks good...except reach should be 10 feet based on the example of the whiptail centipede. Basically, they're so long they have reach :)
And yeah, for the saves I was just calculating differences, assuming my math was right :)
Speed often doesn't change with size. Pretty much your call. The Climb bonus does indeed come from having a climb speed.