| Jeffrey Swank Contributor |
Awhile back I posted an idea and level chart of a Gold Dragon to be played by levels...
A "burning" question came up in my play testing this gold dragon from first level and up.
One of the other players’ couldn’t imagine me as a small hatchling growing larger as a creature as we gained experience...instead of this happening by passage of time.
That got me thinking; yeah I guess this could be a problem. In the play testing I am not overpowered, but how do I explain "realistically" that suddenly when I hit a certain level I grow a size category?
I came up with this idea...and would love feedback or help with the technical number crunching if possible.
So...there is the entry in the Draconomicon about the ageing Great Wyrm avoiding "twilight" and trying to die with dignity by ingesting its treasure hoard. (That idea stuck with me)
There also is a part about “Why do dragons hoard treasure” (being a packrat, sheer pleasure of shiny things, status symbol) and while those are all nice – sometimes might not fit the character of each and every dragon, but!
(Here’s my idea) If we combine the two and imagine if the hoarding of treasure could actually increase the power of the dragon itself – by the dragon ingesting it?!
So now instead of just jumping up a size category when the dragon levels with the proper xp, he would have a restriction to be fulfilled with the ingestion of a certain amount in magic items/gold value before his metamorphosis took place. And if he had not accumulated the proper amount he would have to take a character class (i.e. fighter, wizard or something) instead of advancing to the dragon class of the increased size category. Without such consuming of ones hoard the dragon would age normally and grow in size with age. But this could beanother driving force as why they hoard treasure...to increase in power and size more quickly.
Now I need to flesh out how much should be charged at each size increase.
| Jeffrey Swank Contributor |
Thanks, I found a chart in the Draco book that shows average hoard size per CR and might assimilate those values somehow. Want to try to make it level approipriate for a character adventuring, not too easy - but not impossible and limit the person from keeping some of the fun magic items he might find.
| Madcap Storm King |
One idea was in a for-sale class, the dragon knight. The dragon's bond with its rider lets it, basically, supercharge its growth in exchange for fusing the two's minds till the rider dies.
I would say that maybe the dragon can create an aging potion with all that dough and magically age himself to be older and thus bigger.
| Jeffrey Swank Contributor |
So after a bit of consideration - Im play testing the dragon with the goal being 25% of character level gold value to be injested to raise in Size catergory. I one gets to the level xp where one would raise in size but had not injested the proper amount, then they would have to take a character level of some sort (ie..fighter,wizard or something)
| Phasics |
So after a bit of consideration - Im play testing the dragon with the goal being 25% of character level gold value to be injested to raise in Size catergory. I one gets to the level xp where one would raise in size but had not injested the proper amount, then they would have to take a character level of some sort (ie..fighter,wizard or something)
I think you need to settle on th progression from level 1-20 before you start, dragons have a tendancy for being quite underpowered in a group of PC's of the same level. Especially if your going to mix in levels of fighter or wizard you need to check what his attack and damage are at those levels and compare against the party fighter.
If he taking wiz levels then you need to decide if dragon levels count towards caster level otherwise his spells are going to be so woefully behind the group they'll be pretty much useless.
If you want spells , ading spell like abilites at the cost of feats etc may be a better way to go and keep him straight dragon the whole way.
also consider what role in the group he's going to play tank ? dps ? and modify the progression so that he's always good at doing that.
e.g. reduce the frequency of the breath weapon and beef up melee attacks and HP to make it more tankish, or lower HP and melee weapons and let him fire off the breath weapon often. or cut down the effetivness of both and let him pickup a handful of x/day spell like abilites.
You don't want to it getting to a point where the dragon charcter feels like a 5th wheel in the group and contributes very little
| Phasics |
Alternativley
don't use class levels for dragon progression
Create a race of "Dragon"
and then give him normal class progression.
Race
Dragon
+2 to one Stat
Dragon traits
Small Size
(and thats all)
(through feats give acess to breath weapons and flight and size change at appropriate levels)
but otherwise he has full class progression and stay's balenced withing the group and "dragon" is more about the RP flavour of the character and less about the mechanics
| Jeffrey Swank Contributor |
http://docs.google.com/View?id=dg9h9kh2_0hsm4qqd7
Go to Gold Dragon.
That was the link to the break down of level progression in the first post. I do like the idea of making it a flavor race as well if this doesnt work out - either too weak or too powerful. But so far he seems to be right with the rest of the group at 5th level. He is broken down by level and matches the HD level and abilities in the Pathfinder Beasti Book.
| Falrien |
The thing with playing Dragon characters is that you need to age them, not just add Dragon HD - it just doesn't make sense. Add class levels instead when it's inappropriate for adding DragHD.
Example.
You want to play a Gold dragon, right?
Cool!
Wyrmling Gold CR: 7 so when the party is level 7 you can make you baba dragon and throw him in with the team, happy days.
That character grows like any other monster character, by adding levels and doing that CR reduction thing from the BEstiary.
Your dragon HD, abilities, size and all that only change when (If it's a baby dragon) 5 IN GAME years pass at which time the next 2 levels (Because Very young is +2 CR)the party gain are, for the dragon gained as Dragon hit dice, gradually upgrading him to Very Young.
ie: Medium Size, +2 HD, +3 Natural armour, x2 Breath weapon, +4 Str, -2 Dex and +2 Con, int, wis and Cha.
Simples.
| Falrien |
The thing with playing Dragon characters is that you need to age them, not just add Dragon HD - it just doesn't make sense. Add class levels instead when it's inappropriate for adding DragHD.
Example.
You want to play a Gold dragon, right?
Cool!
Wyrmling Gold CR: 7 so when the party is level 7 you can make you baba dragon and throw him in with the team, happy days.
That character grows like any other monster character, by adding levels and doing that CR reduction thing from the BEstiary.
Your dragon HD, abilities, size and all that only change when (If it's a baby dragon) 5 IN GAME years pass at which time the next 2 levels (Because Very young is +2 CR)the party gain are, for the dragon gained as Dragon hit dice, gradually upgrading him to Very Young.
ie: Medium Size, +2 HD, +3 Natural armour, x2 Breath weapon, +4 Str, -2 Dex and +2 Con, int, wis and Cha.Simples.
Also, of course, as these changes happen over 2 levels, it's easy to stagger and you just pop the size increase on the second level.
The Dragon won't change in a Racial HD way until he is 15 years old. When he'll take another 2 levels out and become Young.