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So I’m making an assassin type character for our upcoming CoT game. Seeing as we are to be "heroes" the true Assassin class doesn’t really fit. (This could be argued but I’ve discussed it with my GM and we have an understanding.) I’m thinking Tiefling and am using the high fantasy? (20pt) pool for stats. What I’m looking for is a stealthy, up close, affective killer build. I have a few ideas already but I figured I may as well weigh all of my options. So... Pure rogue, fighter/rogue, what feats, traits, stat spread, etc? Id like him to be rather charming (Silver tongue) and a decent skill monkey (fairly good Int?). Thanks for the help!
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This just popped into the ol' noggin, but have you thought about using the Avenger. Just change the assassin's name in the core rulebook, change the alignment and the requirement to: The character must have killed an enemy leader or champion in defense of his homeland or nation. Could see if your DM allows that.
Other than that... Is this strictly PFRGP or are splat books being used? Can other Pathfinder books be used?
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I've recently been toying around with the idea of a Fighter/Shadowdancer with Spring Attack and Vital Strike, possibly dumping a lot of points into UMD so I could make heavy use of Wands of Darkness... Of course, Rogue/Shadowdancer could work very easily as well, and you would have Sneak Attack backing you up rather than Vital Strike, plus many many more skill points and almost as many combat tricks (weapon finesse talent, combat trick talent). Hell, maybe take 2 levels of Alchemist to get poison use, a few helpful extracts, the Mutagen (+4 bonus to dex for -2 wisdom? Score!) for a nice boost every so often, and maybe even the smoke bomb discovery to some escapes. Notice, it'll also give you the ability to use wands of CLW without needing UMD. Just a thought, though.
With a 20 point spread I tend to go with 15-14-14-13-10-10, boosting the 15 to 17 with a racial bonus, then to 18 at 4th level, then boosting the 13 to a 14 at 8th level. With a rogue you would probably want the stats set up in a way like this, highest first- Dex, Int, Cha, Con, Wis, Str. Elf might be good if you're hard up for the Int and all of their other stuff is helpful too, but there is no skill-point difference between the elves and humans, while you'll have 1 less hp/level. Judgment call, really.
Use a rapier and have a darkwood buckler, don't worry it works even if you aren't proficient with shields. Chain shirt is a no-brainer, and your first source of AC should be enchanting the shield and armor, with a secondary thought towards rings of protection and amulet of nat. armor when those become cheaper.
Human first level feats- Dodge and Improved Initiative. 2nd level rogue talent should be Weapon Finesse, and you can play it by ear from there. If you want to become a Shadowdancer, pick up Mobility and Combat Reflexes for your 3rd and 5th level, if not then Weapon Focus and Dazzling Display may be good choices, just make sure to save your Combat Trick rogue talent for 8th level so you can pick up Shatter Defenses (this works wonders for rogues, especially ranged-focused rogues, although you will need precise shot to make that work...).
Baaaaah, sorry if that's a little unorganized, but I write things as they come to me, so I can't really help it. Anyways, hope some of my advice helps!
EDIT: Improved/Greater Trip may be very helpful as it helps you get in a load of sneak attack damage... Although, with str being a dump stat in this particular build, it also requires you to take Agile Maneuvers to be decent at that, sadly... I still don't know why it isn't wrapped into Weapon Finesse
You could try the assassin kit I made for the rogue, if you're interested.
Ah, the "not an assassin". I played a "not an assassin" once. It was fun. :D
Anyway, (warrior), rogue or (warrior)/rogue is probably your best bet.
(Warrior) in this case means fighter or ranger, maybe barbarian or monk (but paladins will have a hard time with that "underhanded" fighting style).
With a few rogue talents spent on feats, you can be pretty effective in melee. You get plenty of skills, so put your favored class bonus into hit points.
For feats that I'd suggest:
Weapon Finesse (from talent)
Toughness
Two Weapon Fighting
Dodge
Weapon Focus (from talent)
Stealthy or Skill Focus (Stealth)
Great Fortitude (to help in case you poison yourself :) )
Iron Will (the bane of all rogues)
For stats:
(1)-Dex (2)-Con (3)-Wis (4)-Str (5)-Int (6)-Cha
For race:
A small race would actually benefit you greatly. Small size means higher attack and AC with only a little reduction to damage. Halfling or Gnome maybe.
For other talents:
Fast Stealth
Opportunist
Slippery Mind
More feats!
Rogue seems the optimal starting point - you might even dip bard at 2nd level, pick up expeditious retreat and another spell to augment the stealth (fast stealth talent + exped. ret. = full stealth bonus at 120 ft per round). Perform (act) for disguise type situations.
Improved/Greater Trip may be very helpful as it helps you get in a load of sneak attack damage...
How's that? Also, if he uses a weapon to trip, weapon finesse applies.
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Paladin/Monk. Skill Focus (Stealth), Take Acrobatics and things like Boots of Striding and Springing.
Detect Evil, declare your foe the target of your smite, and quietly head in with a hidden blade, dispatching them with a coup-de-grace. Pray quietly over the corpse and make a rapid get-away.
A paladin must be of lawful good alignment and loses all class features except proficiencies if she ever willingly commits an evil act.
Additionally, a paladin's code requires that she respect legitimate authority, act with honor (not lying, not cheating, not using poison, and so forth), help those in need (provided they do not use the help for evil or chaotic ends), and punish those who harm or threaten innocents.
The part that might get you is the "act with honor" part. There is no deception in what you do (never disguise yourself), no cheating (what you do is no game), no using poison (never poison your blade, when the righteousness of your cause should burn them enough).
Your job is to punish those who threaten innocents, and you are the ultimate ascetic.
With a few rogue talents spent on feats, you can be pretty effective in melee. You get plenty of skills, so put your favored class bonus into hit points.
For feats that I'd suggest:
Weapon Finesse (from talent)
Toughness
Two Weapon Fighting
Dodge
Weapon Focus (from talent)
Stealthy or Skill Focus (Stealth)
Great Fortitude (to help in case you poison yourself :) )
Iron Will (the bane of all rogues)For stats:
(1)-Dex (2)-Con (3)-Wis (4)-Str (5)-Int (6)-ChaFor race:
A small race would actually benefit you greatly. Small size means higher attack and AC with only a little reduction to damage. Halfling or Gnome maybe.For other talents:
Fast Stealth
Opportunist
Slippery Mind
More feats!
You took alot of liberties there from what the conept was supposed to be.
Really for an up close killer, I'd go Tengu with an elven curve blade. But if you want a tiefling, I'd either go with a rapier and darkwood shield, or twin short swords. You might consider a few-levels dip into either a wizard or sorceror, to give you a few extra attack, perception, and stealth options. As far as feats, build up your 2-weapon fighting and work on your feinting (and mobile feats to flank with the party tank when possible). Also get the weapon finesse rogue talent.
The 3 classes that really work for an assassin for me are Rogue, Bard, and Ranger, or a combination of the 3.
Rogue: Obvious choice. Sneak attact, natural stealth. Normal tactic is to go TWF and dice up the enemy. I disagree with everyone else on the order of stats though. Strength is best not forgotten about in a rogue. The boosts to damage are important, and if you don't need weapon finnesse you will come out way ahead.
Bard: Not so obvious, but they get great stealth skills and spells, a cover identity that is let into places others would not be, and can deal out decent damage. Not nearly the combat monster of the Rogue or Ranger though.
Ranger: Favored Enemy: Human and track give you bonuses to finding your quarry. They get stealth abilities (Favored Terrain Urban + Hide in Plane Sight). Their spell list doesn't really match, but there are some things on there that are very useful. I would take the ranged tree and use your normal feats for traditional two handed weapon. Even though the non-animal companion is not that good, I would probably go that way instead, or take an inconspicuous dog.
If your GM will allow3rd party products, may I suggest the Shadow Assassin? I think it'll do most of what you want:
http://paizo.com/store/downloads/otherWorldCreations/pathfinderRPG/v5748btp y8bns
Hyrum.
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Vital Strike does require a BAB of +6. A rogue gets a BAB of +6 when he reaches 8th level (he also gets a rogue talent at this level that could be used to gain a combat feat, assuming you didn't use it for a different one earlier in your career). Did anyone suggest that they could take it earlier?
Anyways, I can't really suggest Vital Strike for a rogue that is using a one-handed finesse weapon. It doesn't really add that much, honestly.
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This just popped into the ol' noggin, but have you thought about using the Avenger.
Oh look, someone reflavored mechanics to suit a different character type. How amazing. :)
On the OP, Fighter mixed with either Ranger or Rogue.
Ranger will maintain your full BAB, and give you an always on bonus to damage against one creature type. Go FE:human, because it will always come into play in session, barring dungeon o' monsters.
Rogue will give you sneak attack, which has a wider range of targets but won't be as reliable against those targets.
Either way, Fighter will give you the feats to power up. I recommend high-Str with a two-handed weapon for a large base damage. Greatsword with a 16 Str is minimum 6 damage a hit, even if you don't get your FE/Sneak Attack damage on the hit. Vital Strike will make this even worse. Weapon choice doesn't affect your Stealth check, so you'll come out of nowhere and cut people in half.
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Hadn't really thought about the ranger option all that much... Not bad. Getting some good idea's here, I do want to stay with the tiefling flavor and am going for a fairly refined "professional" with an upper class servant's background. I figure I will need some mundane skills (would profession: housekeep cover the in's and out's of basicly being a butler? Or do I need to spend some ranks on things like Craft and the like?) Social skills are a must (aside from being valuable in any circumstance) and some knowledge: Nobility would help with flavor.
Our GM typically sticks with pure Pathfinder (core, splat, etc) and I'd like to keep away from ranged combat (I've recently played an archer style ranger... fun... but its time for a change of pace) Feat/class selection are still up in the air. Thanks for the advice so far, any other thoughts?
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Ranger will maintain your full BAB, and give you an always on bonus to damage against one creature type. Go FE:human, because it will always come into play in session, barring dungeon o' monsters.Rogue will give you sneak attack, which has a wider range of targets but won't be as reliable against those targets.
Either way, Fighter will give you the feats to power up. I recommend high-Str with a two-handed weapon for a large base damage. Greatsword with a 16 Str is minimum 6 damage a hit, even if you don't get your FE/Sneak Attack damage on the hit. Vital Strike will make this even worse. Weapon choice doesn't affect your Stealth check, so you'll come out of nowhere and cut people in half.
yes, that's what i meant to say. A few levels of Fighter to get WF, poss as much as Wpn Spec and Weapon Training for say, a greatsword, then Hide around a corner, step out, BAM, Vital Strike Sneak Attack with a greatsword.
good call, TOZ
-t