Treating Deadly Wounds.

[Cylerist]

I have two questions on this function of healing.
1. Since it states you get a -2 on the check for each use of a healers kit you are missing, can you try this use of the skill with no healer kit and take the -4 penalty.
2. If you fail can you keep trying until you make the roll. (I know it is once 24hours for healing HP but is the 1 try per day or 1 success per day).

Thanks

[cwslyclgh]

PRD wrote:

You must expend two uses from a healer's kit to perform this task.

Looks to me like by the RAW you can't attempt it with out a healers kit. That said in my game I would probably allow it (though probably at a higher then -4 penalty... maybe -6 or -8, to reflect that only people really good at healing can do it with out supplies).

PRD wrote:

A creature can only benefit from its deadly wounds being treated within 24 hours of being injured and never more than once per day

The key word here is benefit, looks to me like it can be retried if it fails (assuming that the healer has some way of knowing his treatment was not successful, remember HP are an abstract metagame concept that doesn't exist for the people inside the game, so the healer would not have any way of knowing how many HP his patient had before or after the attempt).

[Cylerist]

cwslyclgh wrote:

PRD wrote:

You must expend two uses from a healer's kit to perform this task.

Looks to me like by the RAW you can't attempt it with out a healers kit.

You missed the line after the one you posted.
RAW: You must expend two uses from a healer’s
kit to perform this task. You take a –2 penalty on your
Heal skill check for each use from the healer’s kit that
you lack.
So again I ask if you have no uses or no kit can you use the skill with a -4?

[KenderKin]

The attempt could be made w/o a healers kit.

This is where some other things come into play such as profession herbalism, or knowledge nature, or survival.

Spangum moss stops bleeding and allows clots to form

duct tape works on a sucking chest wound,

A healers kit is not necessary. In fact the game eqivalent of self-adhesive gauze is probably giant spider web......

[cwslyclgh]

I did not miss the next line... I simply choose to read the word MUST as meaning MUST, period. the next line is simply about what to do if your healers kit is not fully stocked.

[cwslyclgh]

Kenderkin, he is not talking about first aid (ie stabalizing a dying person) which is where your examples would apply (and which do not require a healers kit), he is talking about the "treat a deadly wound" function which actually gives HP back to an injured person.

[KenderKin]

Healers kit
This collection of bandages and herbs provides a +2 circumstance bonus on Heal checks. A healer's kit is exhausted after 10 uses.

A knowledgable PC should be able to restock the kit w/o too much trouble!!!!

[Karui Kage]

As it says 'for each use that you lack', I would say you could treat deadly wounds at a -4. If you still needed at least one use from a Healer's Kit, then it would say something like 'you take a -2 if you only have 1 use left in the kit'. As it is, it's implying the penalty could be taken for multiple 'uses that you lack'.

So yes, you can treat deadly wounds at a -4 with no healer's kit.

[2bz2p]

Agree, -4 if you are without a kit but knowledgeable in heal. Curious - how do you manufacture your own healer's kit?

[Aelryinth]

I'd make a Heal check just like a crafting check, and let that determine the value of healing components you manage to assemble in one day.

More likely you'd just buy the needed comps, i.e. buy a new kit.

==Aelryinth

[Cavall]

There is an incredibly cheap magic item that is a vest that always acts as if you have a healers kit on you, and allows you to heal as if casting essentially a lesser restoration spell with a healing check. It is really amazing and fully reccomend if you are going the healers route.

[Cavall]

2bz2p wrote:

Agree, -4 if you are without a kit but knowledgeable in heal. Curious - how do you manufacture your own healer's kit?

A survival check would do as well for a more "natural" healer. Using the crafting rules and substitutting the skill used would work fine.

[Diego Rossi]

I think that you need the kit but not the charges. If you lack the kit you use the "improvised tools" rule.
So if you are bandaging wounds with strips of your robe and sticking them with a sewing needle and fishing line you get a -2 modifier over and above the modifier for lacking the kit charges.