Grappled Condition and Uncanny Dodge

[With Club Sauce]

Uncanny Dodge states that: "[a creature] still loses her Dexterity bonus to Armor Class if immobilized."

The grappled condition states that: "A grappled creature is restrained... Grappled creatures *cannot move* and take a –4 penalty to Dexterity."

The issue of whether or not one could sneak attack a grappled creature that had Uncanny Dodge came up today. I just want to make sure I'm clear on the rules. "Cannot move" is *not* the same thing as "immobilized", correct? I can't find immobilized listed among any of the conditions. Does it no longer exist in Pathfinder? If that is true, then a creature with Uncanny Dodge never loses their Dex bonus to AC (aside from feinting) and can only be sneak attacked via feint or the Helpless condition? By RAW, it seems as if the Cowering condition would not negate the Dex bonus of an Uncanny Dodge character, either.

[Turin the Mad]

With Club Sauce wrote:

Uncanny Dodge states that: "[a creature] still loses her Dexterity bonus to Armor Class if immobilized."

The grappled condition states that: "A grappled creature is restrained... Grappled creatures *cannot move* and take a –4 penalty to Dexterity."

The issue of whether or not one could sneak attack a grappled creature that had Uncanny Dodge came up today. I just want to make sure I'm clear on the rules. "Cannot move" is *not* the same thing as "immobilized", correct? I can't find immobilized listed among any of the conditions. Does it no longer exist in Pathfinder? If that is true, then a creature with Uncanny Dodge never loses their Dex bonus to AC (aside from feinting) and can only be sneak attacked via feint or the Helpless condition? By RAW, it seems as if the Cowering condition would not negate the Dex bonus of an Uncanny Dodge character, either.

The inability to move = immobilized by definition. Characters with uncanny dodge are royally hosed when they are grappled - the trick is latching onto them in the first place, especially after freedom of movement becomes available.

[Ughbash]

Immobilized is worse then unable to move.

Immobilized is like paralyzed, you can not twist or turn or anything and are effectively helpless. Unabel to move when grappled means you aer still twisting and fighting but can not move from one 5' square to another. Since grappled imposes a -4 dex penalty but does not render the person flatfooted uncanny dodge does not matter.

Uncanny dodge says she is not caught flat footed. If however the rogue had an 18 dex he and was grappled he would have a 14 dex while grappled. He has not lost his bonus of dex to AC, though it has been reduced just as it would with a ray of clumsiness or a dex based poison.