My take on that would be the same as wizards.
The caster can leave some of his spell slots open(unmemorized)and if he NEEDS to have a utility spell that isnt normally part of his daily compliment, he can stop,meditate for 10 minutes and fill an empty slot with something like break enchantment or cure disease or any number of spells. Now this does not mean he can cast all of his spells for the day and then remem outside of his normal prayer time(morning,noon or night)or blow his spells for the day and then just gett'em all back more than once a day.
My take, my two cents worth.
I agree with Mr. Tindall - it's the first of your two options. A divine spellcaster can leave some slots open, and then fill them later on, as required. The preparation time would be up to an hour (based on the proportion of spells being prepared), but always at least 15 minutes, no matter how few spells were being prepared.
Wait...
Don't clerics and druids get to prepare their spells at only one point during the day? How would they then get a chance to prepare spells in empty slots?
Does it actually say that in the rules or it is a typical campaign trait? I ask because I remember this mentioned by many people, but can't seem to find anything "By the Book" that supports it. IF it is a campaign trait then yes in that campaign it is law, but that doesn't mean it's system wide.
It does look like there is some RAW to it:
Each cleric must choose a time at which he must spend 1 hour each day in quiet contemplation or supplication to regain his daily allotment of spells.
That was from the cleric entry. Additionally in the Preparing Divine spells section
Time of Day
A divine spellcaster chooses and prepares spells ahead of time, just as a wizard does. However, a divine spellcaster does not require a period of rest to prepare spells. Instead, the character chooses a particular part of the day to pray and receive spells. The time is usually associated with some daily event. If some event prevents a character from praying at the proper time, he must do so as soon as possible. If the character does not stop to pray for spells at the first opportunity, he must wait until the next day to prepare spells.
That does seem to support the 'specific time of day only' line of thought.
Sean Mahoney
In the following section, however, the SRD goes on to say:
Spell Selection and Preparation
A divine spellcaster does not have to prepare all his spells at once. However, the character’s mind is considered fresh only during his or her first daily spell preparation, so a divine spellcaster cannot fill a slot that is empty because he or she has cast a spell or abandoned a previously prepared spell.
This makes it clear that a divine spellcaster can have a second (and third, etc.) daily spell preparation, in which he or she can fill slots left empty in an earlier preparation (but not any that are empty from casting or abandoning a spell).
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If some event prevents a character from praying at the proper time, he must do so as soon as possible. If the character does not stop to pray for spells at the first opportunity, he must wait until the next day to prepare spells.
Seems to suggest that you still only get to prepare spells once period.
Callum, your quote seems to suggest to me a ban against preparing spells only in the "recent casting" category, so that anything you held over from the previous day would count against you spells today.
If some event prevents a character from praying at the proper time, he must do so as soon as possible. If the character does not stop to pray for spells at the first opportunity, he must wait until the next day to prepare spells.Seems to suggest that you still only get to prepare spells once period.
Callum, your quote seems to suggest to me a ban against preparing spells only in the "recent casting" category, so that anything you held over from the previous day would count against you spells today.
I think your SRD quote is saying that if a character doesn't pray as close as possible to the proper time, then he or she is forbidden from preparing spells until the "holy" time the next day. I don't see why it suggests that only one preparation is allowed in any given day. In fact, the later reference to a "first" spell preparation makes it explicit that there can be more than one.
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I think your SRD quote is saying that if a character doesn't pray as close as possible to the proper time, then he or she is forbidden from preparing spells until the "holy" time the next day. I don't see why it suggests that only one preparation is allowed in any given day. In fact, the later reference to a "first" spell preparation makes it explicit that there can be more than one.
I took that line from the link you provided to the SRD. Not only does the page you provide contradict your argument, but the argument you gave is little more than an interpretation. Where does it say you can prepare spells more than once?
Your interpretation of the word first here is just way off. It has nothing to do with how many you get, but when it must be done. There is no implication, you must prepare spells ASAP. This is clear in its content and context.
If you don't prepare your spells at the earliest point possible, then you are forbidden from being able to prepare spells until the next day.
Emphasis mine:
If the character does not stop to pray for spells at the first opportunity, he must wait until the next day to prepare spells.
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Stuff that is wrong
Here is the following from the PHB 3.5 (page number 32) under the cleric description, last paragraph under the Spells section. Emphasis mine
Clerics do not acquire their spells from books or scrolls, nor do they prepare them through study. Instead, they meditate or pray for their spells, recieving them through their own strength of faith or as divine inspiration.
I don't think that could be any clearer that you are wrong. They do in fact pray for spells. Under the druid you'll find they do it the same way clerics do.
To keep going:
Each cleric must choose a time at which he must spend 1 hour each day in quiet contemplation or supplication to regain his daily allotment of spells. Typically, this hour is at dawn or noon for good clerics and at dusk or midnight for evil ones . Time spent resting has no effect on whether a cleric can prepare spells. A cleric may prepare and cast any spell on the cleric spell list (page 183), provided that he can cast spells of that level, but must choose which spells to prepare during his daily meditation.
They do in fact pray for their spells and may only do so once per day with the times of day already preset and determined by the rules. It is not interpretation here, it is clear stated rules. This has been a part of the game for many editions, and did not change into the 3rd edition at all.
They could pray for spells and separately pray for their spell slots to be freshened. This would not contradict those statements. The fact that one prays for A, does not mean that one can't pray for B at a later time.
Where does it say you can prepare spells more than once?
Here, in the SRD section I quoted a few posts back:-
Spell Selection and Preparation
A divine spellcaster does not have to prepare all his spells at once. However, the character’s mind is considered fresh only during his or her first daily spell preparation, so a divine spellcaster cannot fill a slot that is empty because he or she has cast a spell or abandoned a previously prepared spell.
I can't see any interpretation of those two sentences that doesn't include the option to prepare spells more than once. If you can, please enlighten us.
Your interpretation of the word first here is just way off. It has nothing to do with how many you get, but when it must be done.
Sorry, my post was a bit misleading here. I was referring to the "first" in the SRD quote above ("his or her first daily spell preparation"), not in your SRD quote ("at the first opportunity"). I should have made that clearer.
If you don't prepare your spells at the earliest point possible, then you are forbidden from being able to prepare spells until the next day.
Yes, I agree absolutely. But when you do prepare your spells at the earliest possible opportunity, you don't have to prepare them all at once. Later, when you want to prepare some more spells, your mind isn't fresh - so you can't re-fill a slot you filled during your first daily spell preparation, you can only fill any slots you deliberately left open at that time.
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Um, I don't know how to point this out, but you're not agreeing with me at all. :p
Refer to my above post. In it you will find the line that I bolded that points out that clerics can only prepare their spells at one point in the day, this doesn't mean ALL divine spellcasters. I will agree with you that others may not have this stipulation, but Clerics (and by extension druids, paladins, and rangers since they prepare their spells in exactly the same manner) don't. They may leave slots open yes, but that means they must wait until the next day to prepare spells. There are a few other divine casting 1-20 level classes, but none of them have to bother with this rule since they spontaneously cast.
I have no idea why you'd actually do this, considering that you wouldn't even be able to convert those spells to Cure or Summoning spells, but you could leave all of them open if you really wanted to while playing a Cleric or Druid.
One thing I know we can agree on, we could pick the SRD and core 3.5 books to pieces with contradictory quotes. :D
Where does it say you can prepare spells more than once?
The 3.5 PH is even more explicit than the SRD (emphasis mine):-
A divine spellcaster does not have to prepare all his spells at once. He can leave some of his spell slots open in order to fill them later, just as a wizard can. However, the character’s mind is considered fresh only during his or her first daily spell preparation, so a divine spellcaster cannot fill a slot that is empty because he or she has cast a spell or abandoned a previously prepared spell.
This is in the section "Divine Spells" that starts on p.179 with the sentence "Clerics, druids, experienced paladins, and experienced rangers an cast divine spells." It then goes on to explain the "few differences" in the manner wizards and divine spellcasters (e.g. clerics, druids, experienced paladins, and experienced rangers) prepare their spells. One of the key differences is that, unlike a wizard, a divine spellcaster doesn't require a period of rest. Instead, the divine spellcaster chooses a time of day when they must pray.
Thus, you can see that the "time of day" restriction for clerics, et al, is equivalent to the "rest" requirement for wizards. Once a spellcaster has met this initial requirement, he or she is then able to prepare spells. Subsequently, either type of spellcaster has the option of immediately preparing all his or her spells, or leaving some slots open to be prepared later. If the initial requirement is not met, however, no spells can be prepared at all - and it's a lot easier for a wizard to meet her requirement (rest) at some later point than it is for a cleric to meet his (time of day).
To put it another way, meeting the initial requirement gives the spellcaster the blank slots. He or she must subsequently spend time filling the slots (up to an hour, depending on the proportion of slots filled). This second preparation stage can be broken up, and carried out at different points through the day.
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Note that the text does not include any phrases such as, "or other circumstances", "such as", "etc.", "for example" or any other terms that suggest additional conditions under which spells cannot later be prepared. Rather, it is explicit with two and only two conditions. Assuming you meet the 8-hour rule and the prayed and made the slots "fresh" at the right time or ASAP afterwards rule then if your slot was made "fresh" by your first set of prayers and does not violate either of these two conditions then you can prepare it at a later time in the day with additional prayers prior to your next daily cycle.
This is where the Class descriptions come into conflict with this. Generally, I would agree that this would be fine with the rules as presented. However, the Cleric class specifically says that this is not the case with that class. They can only prepare their spells at one point during the day that is already pre-set. If they miss the window and fail to prepare spells, then they may not.
Just to make things clear (since I'm kind of doubting that they are) I think that these rules provided for clerics are pretty stupid. Why create rules for casting divine spells in general, then set down different conditions for the class and lump all the classes together by saying "as a cleric does"? I do think the rules are clear, but that doesn't mean I think they're good in this case. I'm really thinking this was a just a case of the editor missing what was actually being said.
As a caveat, later preparation of spells may or may not interfere with subsequent preparation the following day. I would rule that if you prepare an "open" slot within the 8-hour window prior to your next "refresh" that it effectively "blocks" that slot for the following day's refresh.
Anyway, IMHO, this is pretty "clear", or as much as it's going to get. If you can't buy (or at least window-shop) this argument then it's time to simply agree to disagree and end this "discussion" :-)
Totally agree here, but not sure what it has to do with the above.
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Anyway, now that the smilies are out of my system, I think I have to make this clear to Callum: I'm not trying to tell you how to play your game. The rules are there to be played with or ignored at will, it doesn't really matter what anyone else says as long as you and your group have fun. Thankfully, I don't think this is something that will come up often in my games. Phew! :D
Oops, extra emoticon. Hehe
Edit: I wonder if it is possible for a community-made update of the SRD rules, or if that is not possible. Without the old rules supported (Pathfinder doesn't count if someone doesn't want to update from their 3.5 games) then there is no real way to clarify this except via GM fiat. I geuss that's fine, but its really a question for another thread.
This is where the Class descriptions come into conflict with this. Generally, I would agree that this would be fine with the rules as presented. However, the Cleric class specifically says that this is not the case with that class. They can only prepare their spells at one point during the day that is already pre-set. If they miss the window and fail to prepare spells, then they may not.
I think you are making an assumption that is not necessary. Let's look at what you bolded.
Instead, they meditate or pray for their spells...
Each cleric must choose a time at which he must spend 1 hour each day in quiet contemplation or supplication to regain his daily allotment of spells. Typically, this hour is at dawn or noon for good clerics and at dusk or midnight for evil ones . ...
From the first one, we get that clerics obtain their spells through prayer, as opposed to study like a wizard.
In the second one, it does not say he actually has to pray, instead it says he must spend 1 hour in "quiet contemplation or supplication".
Now you seem to be assuming that the only time that a cleric can pray for spells during the whole day is during this hour. In fact it does not say that. It merely says that in order to get a spell, they have to pray. They could pray during that one hour period or they could pray later in the day. The method of preparing the spell is through prayer, but that prayer does not have to be the same as the one hour.
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Supplication:
This says its prayerThis also says that it is prayer
This also says that it is prayer
I think its pretty clear here that these are one and the same and that your assertion that I am assuming is wrong. At best, it could probably be argued that "quiet contemplation" doesn't fit the bill. I still say it does, since I *assume* that its in direct reference to those who don't worship gods.
However, the Cleric class specifically says that this is not the case with that class. They can only prepare their spells at one point during the day that is already pre-set. If they miss the window and fail to prepare spells, then they may not.
Just to make things clear (since I'm kind of doubting that they are) I think that these rules provided for clerics are pretty stupid. Why create rules for casting divine spells in general, then set down different conditions for the class and lump all the classes together by saying "as a cleric does"?
I really don't think the cleric class rules specifically say that. I agree that it's a possible interpretation of the rules as set out there, but only if you ignore the later rules about preparing divine spells. (And note that the bit about "missing the window" comes from that later section.) The cleric class sets out the basic rules for that class, but further detail is provided later in the rules about casting divine spells, turning undead, etc., and those rules should be considered in conjunction with the class rules. Note that if you only read the wizard class description, you can get the impression that the wizard prepares all his or her spells at once - it's only in the later section about preparing wizard spells that the option of leaving some slots open is discussed.
Also, as I tried to explain in my previous post, the term "divine spellcaster" in the 3.5 SRD or PH is just a short way of saying "cleric, druid, experienced paladin, or experienced ranger". Those are all the classes that prepare divine spells, and thus are lumped together for that purpose (which is also why the other three classes say they prepare and cast spells "the way a cleric does"). As there is only one class that prepares arcane spells - the wizard - there's no need for an equivalent term "arcane spellcaster" in the rules on preparing wizard spells. (If, say, the bard had to prepare his or her spells in advance, then that term would have been used, and that section would have been called "Preparing Arcane Spells" instead.)
I think I have to make this clear to Callum: I'm not trying to tell you how to play your game. The rules are there to be played with or ignored at will, it doesn't really matter what anyone else says as long as you and your group have fun.
Oh yes, absolutely. In fact, I was going to say a similar thing to you in my previous post! But the OP asked what the line "A divine spellcaster does not have to prepare all his spells at once" in the SRD meant, and that's the question we've been trying to answer.
I run it that the Priest gets his prepared spells at dawn as he is a follower of Pelor as it fits with the mythology thingy. The Sun driving away Darkness that sort of thing. I suppose high noon would also be a good time to get them as well.
So if you wanted to take the effort each deities priests could get his/her spells and differing times ie. a sea deity gives them at high tide that day, a darkness deity and midnight, etc.
And it is a good thing not to fill all those slots, you never know!
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Also, as I tried to explain in my previous post, the term "divine spellcaster" in the 3.5 SRD or PH is just a short way of saying "cleric, druid, experienced paladin, or experienced ranger".
The issue is that there is a general description and a class description. Divine spellcaster is a general term, and the classes are more specific. When it comes to utilizing the rules written then the the class description trumps the general rules in the back of the book. Specifics always do.
A ranger may prepare and cast any spell on the ranger list, provided that he can cast spells of that level, but he must choose which spells to prepare during his daily meditation.
It says a similar thing for Paladins.
The specifics in this place make it abundantly clear that they only get to prepare spells during their daily meditation. Key word there is "daily". They get it once per day.
When it comes to utilizing the rules written then the the class description trumps the general rules in the back of the book.
Hm. I'm not sure where you get this idea from. But if you insist on this belief, and also that the two sections are contradictory, then I can understand how you've arrived at your conclusion. This conclusion means that the rules about leaving spell slots open are useless in the SRD.
Personally, I prefer to look at the rules in totality, and think the sections "in the back of the book" provide further detail and refinement of the rules summarised in the class sections, thus avoiding unnecessary repetition. This approach allows one to make use of the open spell slots rule for prepared spellcasters.
I guess the OP can choose which approach he or she prefers.
The specifics in this place make it abundantly clear that they only get to prepare spells during their daily meditation. Key word there is "daily". They get it once per day.
"Daily" doesn't mean "once per day only". Among other things, it means "done each day".
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When it comes to utilizing the rules written then the the class description trumps the general rules in the back of the book.Hm. I'm not sure where you get this idea from. But if you insist on this belief, and also that the two sections are contradictory, then I can understand how you've arrived at your conclusion. This conclusion means that the rules about leaving spell slots open are useless in the SRD.
Basically, I'm saying that they have indeed made these rules useless. Its an example of overlooking what is actually being said. That doesn't mean I like it, or even want it that way. It just so happens that the rules say this. If the OP wants to ignore it, that's fine with me. That is probably the best way to go since it is likely more fun that way.
The class descriptions must trump the general rules because they get into the specific aspects of a class, the same way that a spell description trumps the general rules for general spellcasting. The classes tell you which spell lists to use, the spell tells you what in addition you need to cast a spell. The general rules are there to give you a baseline, the classes give you the details necessary to play them.
Take the Paladin and Turn Undead for instance. In the class description they have to spell out that he turns undead as a cleric three levels lower. The Class description trumps the description for turning undead in the back of the book.
Personally, I prefer to look at the rules in totality, and think the sections "in the back of the book" provide further detail and refinement of the rules summarised in the class sections, thus avoiding unnecessary repetition. This approach allows one to make use of the open spell slots rule for prepared spellcasters.
I find the rules in the back of the book to be the start. If something in the class description says something different than the general rules, then it is an exception. Exceptions to the rules supercede any general rules.
"Daily" doesn't mean "once per day only". Among other things, it means "done each day".
And how does that mean you can do it more than once? If I got to do it twice a day wouldn't they specify twice a day? How about hourly? In each 8 hour period? How many times do you do something bi-annually? This is definitely a case of just once per day.
StuffSupplication:
This says its prayer
This also says that it is prayer
This also says that it is prayerI think its pretty clear here that these are one and the same and that your assertion that I am assuming is wrong. At best, it could probably be argued that "quiet contemplation" doesn't fit the bill. I still say it does, since I *assume* that its in direct reference to those who don't worship gods.
I'm afraid you missed the entire point of my post.
I'll conceed, that he must pray during that one hour period. Ok.
That still doesn't mean that he has to get all of his spells then.
Requirements:
1. A cleric must pray once a day at a set time to gain his allotment for spells that day.
2. A cleric must pray to prepare spells.
Agreed?
So how is it a contradiction if a cleric prays in the morning (say he is a cleric of a good god) and prepares some of his spells and then later in the day he prays again (notice he has already prayed in the morning so has fulfilled requirement #1) later in the day to fill open slots that he was allocated during that first prayer? Where is the contradiction?
The assumption I was trying to suggest you are making is that requirement 1 = requirement 2. That does not have to be true. Nothing in the actual text suggests that interpretation.
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Requirements:
1. A cleric must pray once a day at a set time to gain his allotment for spells that day.
2. A cleric must pray to prepare spells.Agreed?
So how is it a contradiction if a cleric prays in the morning (say he is a cleric of a good god) and prepares some of his spells and then later in the day he prays again (notice he has already prayed in the morning so has fulfilled requirement #1) later in the day to fill open slots that he was allocated during that first prayer?
The contradiction arises where it says that you must prepare your spells at the first opportunity, or wait until the next day. If you don't prepare your spells, then you forgoe doing so until the next day. Its simple and clear about it.
"Daily" doesn't mean "once per day only". Among other things, it means "done each day".And how does that mean you can do it more than once? If I got to do it twice a day wouldn't they specify twice a day? How about hourly? In each 8 hour period? How many times do you do something bi-annually? This is definitely a case of just once per day.
"Do you mediate often?"
"I make sure to mediate daily.""Oh. So just once a day?"
The contradiction arises where it says that you must prepare your spells at the first opportunity, or wait until the next day. If you don't prepare your spells, then you forgoe doing so until the next day. Its simple and clear about it.
Okay, now you're just circling back round and repeating issues that have already been addressed. Go back to the top of this thread and look at my post responding to the first time you raised this, where I point out that the part of the rules to which you refer doesn't say that you can only prepare spells once a day. Or look at Rezdave's post a little later on, where he spells out the same thing with bullet points. Or, indeed, look at pres man's post that you're replying to, which makes the same point again! There's no requirement to prepare all your spells at the first opportunity.
Several of us have carefully explained, several times, that we don't see a contradiction in these rules, and spelt out our reading of them. But you appear to be so wedded to your position that you don't seem to take on board what we're saying. You insist that things are "clearly" the way you seem them, with no interpretation possible, and that people who disagree with you are "wrong". These statements are not conducive to a civilised discussion, and aren't suggestive of an open-minded approach. Maybe you're right, maybe we're right, but we can at least agree that it's open to interpretation, and speak politely to one another, can't we?
To shore up your position, you have introduced some additional rules of your own - that there is a hierarchy of rules (in which the rule that expressly allows repeated preparation is superseded by another that is not so explicit), and that the word "daily" can only mean "once a day" when used in the D&D rules. If your position is as "clear" as you claim, why have you needed to rely on these 'rules' that don't appear in the text in question?
Finally, let me ask you this. Which do you think is more likely: that these "pretty stupid" core rules were missed by WotC's writers and editors, and thousands of players, both in 3E and the 3.5 revision (and now in the heavily play-tested Pathfinder RPG), and misunderstood by the several contributors to this thread who see things differently to you; or that you might - just might - have misinterpreted them?
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Okay, now you're just circling back round and repeating issues that have already been addressed. Go back to the top of this thread and look at my post responding to the first time you raised this, where I point out that the part of the rules to which you refer doesn't say that you can only prepare spells once a day. Or look at Rezdave's post a little later on, where he spells out the same thing with bullet points. Or, indeed, look at pres man's post that you're replying to, which makes the same point again! There's no requirement to prepare all your spells at the first opportunity.
I'm only restating the issues that haven't been addressed, actually. You only gave what you think is the correct interpretation of the rules, and we’ve been back and forth on it ever since. Neither you or Rezdave actually gave a bit of evidence or quote that proves the wording is as you say. I’ve given many examples where the text says it is once a day.
Also, the quote you gave that you think gives cleric’s extra spell preparations a day says nothing about gaining multiple preparations. In fact, it seems to spell out quite the opposite. It supports my position much more than it supports yours, because it says that
Several of us have carefully explained, several times, that we don't see a contradiction in these rules, and spelt out our reading of them. But you appear to be so wedded to your position that you don't seem to take on board what we're saying. You insist that things are "clearly" the way you seem them, with no interpretation possible, and that people who disagree with you are "wrong".
I’ve said numerous times that I don’t like how the rules are written here, and that I’d be willing to change them. I don’t mean that I like them, just that they say what I don’t want to use in my game. I know you don’t want to use them, and it doesn’t bother me one bit if you do use them or not.
These statements are not conducive to a civilised discussion, and aren't suggestive of an open-minded approach. Maybe you're right, maybe we're right, but we can at least agree that it's open to interpretation, and speak politely to one another, can't we?
When are we not speaking politely to one another? I have seen nothing that would warrant this kind of talk, unless I am missing something. I thought we were having a civilized discussion, but this is the first time I’ve felt like I might be under attack. That’s verging on ad hominem Callum, you’re attacking me and not my arguments. That isn’t cool.
Besides: I wasn’t the first to throw around how “clear” things are.
Emphasis mine:
This makes it clear that a divine spellcaster can have a second (and third, etc.) daily spell preparation, in which he or she can fill slots left empty in an earlier preparation (but not any that are empty from casting or abandoning a spell).
I don’t really want this to turn ad hominem, so we shouldn’t let it devolve to that point if we can avoid it please.
To shore up your position, you have introduced some additional rules of your own - that there is a hierarchy of rules (in which the rule that expressly allows repeated preparation is superseded by another that is not so explicit), and that the word "daily" can only mean "once a day" when used in the D&D rules. If your position is as "clear" as you claim, why have you needed to rely on these 'rules' that don't appear in the text in question?
These rules are used constantly in D&D, not just the text in question. A holistic approach is necessary with the rules, they cannot be ignored to facilitate an argument unless they are an exception.
I’m a gnome; I can use speak with animals each day.I can use it more than once a day now because my GM let me take a feat. Exception.
I’m a half-dragon; I can use my breath weapon each day.
I can use it more than once a day now because my GM let me take a feat. Exception.
1. Every day: Exercise daily.
2. Once a day: Wind the clock daily.
Its just like with all the other abilities useable once per day.
Finally, let me ask you this. Which do you think is more likely: that these "pretty stupid" core rules were missed by WotC's writers and editors, and thousands of players, both in 3E and the 3.5 revision (and now in the heavily play-tested Pathfinder RPG), and misunderstood by the several contributors to this thread who see things differently to you; or that you might - just might - have misinterpreted them?
There is no misinterpretation. The words used say that you may not prepare spells more than once daily if you are a cleric. However, the amount of errata that has come out over the years shows that there are many things that are overlooked by the editors and designers because they don’t come up often enough to get noticed. Errata cannot be made if no one notices it.
Neither can clarifications. I've been saying this whole time that this is rules as written (RAW), but it may not be the rules as intended (RAI).
That first definition does not mean it can only happen once a day. It indicates it happens at least once every day.
These abilities you mention are not described as "daily" but as 1/day. There is a difference, one is a clear game term, the other is not.
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That first definition does not mean it can only happen once a day. It indicates it happens at least once every day.
It specifies once a day. It is also everyday. They are not mutually exclusive.
The very meaning of the word limits this to just once a day.
These abilities you mention are not described as "daily" but as 1/day. There is a difference, one is a clear game term, the other is not.
The word daily has a clear meaning, which is synonymous with 1/day as the definition of daily. I showed that above. Arguing won't change that.
That first definition does not mean it can only happen once a day. It indicates it happens at least once every day.
These abilities you mention are not described as "daily" but as 1/day. There is a difference, one is a clear game term, the other is not.
Totally correct.
I smoke daily, I don't smoke 1/day!|
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That first definition does not mean it can only happen once a day. It indicates it happens at least once every day.
These abilities you mention are not described as "daily" but as 1/day. There is a difference, one is a clear game term, the other is not.
Totally correct.
I smoke daily, I don't smoke 1/day!
If you smoked in D&D, then there would be no limit upon you. However, if you could only access your magical pack of cigarettes once a day then you would be under the D&D usage of the word.
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- Clerics don't have to prepare all their spells for the day at once.
When a cleric prepares spells for the day, the cleric has the option to leave some spell slots open, just as a wizard does. Later in the day, the cleric can stop and repeat her spell preparation to place spells in the empty slots.
In effect, the cleric stops, prays, and meditates at the usual time, and those actions make the cleric's spell slots available for the day. The cleric can fill those slots immediately or she can wait until later. See page 178 in the Player's Handbook for details on repeating the spell preparation.
Source: Wizard.com's Rules of the Game
-GV
Thanks, GreyVulpine.
But this same link also says:
If, however, the proper environment is available at the usual preparation time and the cleric simply decides to skip spell preparation in favor of some other activity, the cleric hasn't been prevented from preparing spells and must wait until the next day to prepare spells.During the course of a campaign, there might be times when a cleric misses an opportunity to prepare spells and it won't be clear if the cleric was truly prevented from doing so. In such cases, it's up to the DM to decide if the cleric could reasonably have found the proper environment for spell preparation. If the DM decides the cleric skipped spell preparation voluntarily, the cleric should have to wait until the next day to prepare spells.
Very conflicting, but glad someone was able to finally point this inconsistency out. Still, this clarification leaves much to be desired in the way it is worded, but I'll concede that it was clarified.
Very conflicting, but glad someone was able to finally point this inconsistency out. Still, this clarification leaves much to be desired in the way it is worded, but I'll concede that it was clarified.
Excellent - thanks for your concession. So, in summary, we can all agree that:-
- The rules expressly state that divine spellcasters do not have to prepare all their spells at once, and can leave some spell slots open for later preparation (on p.180 of the 3.5 PH).
- The rules for clerics preparing their spells (on p.32 of the 3.5 PH) can be interpreted to mean that they must prepare all their spells at once, at their special time of day.
- This possible inconsistency has been clarified by WotC - the intent was for clerics and other divine spellcasters to be able to leave spell slots open, as the rules on p.180 specify.
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Very conflicting, but glad someone was able to finally point this inconsistency out. Still, this clarification leaves much to be desired in the way it is worded, but I'll concede that it was clarified.Excellent - thanks for your concession. So, in summary, we can all agree that:-
- The rules expressly state that divine spellcasters do not have to prepare all their spells at once, and can leave some spell slots open for later preparation (on p.180 of the 3.5 PH).
- The rules for clerics preparing their spells (on p.32 of the 3.5 PH) can be interpreted to mean that they must prepare all their spells at once, at their special time of day.
- This possible inconsistency has been clarified by WotC - the intent was for clerics and other divine spellcasters to be able to leave spell slots open, as the rules on p.180 specify.
Well, the first point could be reworded. It is not expressed very well at all, but required the clarification of part three. EDIT: Hence our very long discussion on the subject: /edit. Otherwise...
Bingo.
That about sums it up. If you don't have the clarification it could easily be read as the second part.